Portland Bookstore Defends “Fuck Portlandia” Sign • Page 3

I wasn't contrasting cross dressers with "regular women", jeez. That would be horribly prejudiced if that was what I was trying to say. You can bold two words from separate points in any post and make it look bad.

If you look at the context of the post I was making the distinction between MISANDRY and feminism, which is the point of that skit. Misandry is an attitude, not an identity. The intent of the skit is two women who hate all men and harshly judge their own store's target market because they pretentiously think the only way to be a feminist is to be anti-men. Its funny to me not because Fred's character is female, but because of the evident hypocrisy and irony in the skit - these women end up contributing to the same sexist ideas theyre trying to fight because their whole platform is based on shaming women for their sexual activity, rather than empowering them to make independent choices.

They don't at all make any comment on gender in any of those bookstore skits. I'm not saying it's wrong to interpret it that way - when you think about it a man acting as a woman for humor isn't too far off from Blackface so I understand where you're coming from. But please don't jump at me because I didn't automatically come to the same conclusion. I have nothing but respect for the rights and feelings of transgender people and I even admitted in the post that I'm not really part of the demographic so my initial perspective doesn't matter

 

Crossdressers and trans women aren't the same thing.

Using the term "regular women" when you mean "women who aren't transgender" is pretty fucked.

As far as the rest is concerned, whatever. I have heard various negative things from trans folks over the years about this show. I can't remember specifics but it isn't limited to a single sketch and I take their word for it over any cis person's considering, well, they have the experience of being transgender.

I'm not even saying this show is some terrible offender against trans people or anything, I'm certain there's much worse, however, the discussion about what constitutes transphobia is for trans folks to have.

 

Noted, thank you, I only repeated that phrase because you bolded it in my post and didn't consider the context.

That is not at all the comparison I was making. Can you please read the posts rather than just skimming them for shitty things I *might* be implying? Really makes me look like a much bigger asshole when you misrepresent my point.

 

I've typed up like ten different responses to this and deleted them all for various reasons. You're welcome to message me if you want to continue this discussion, but I'm not really interested in, or comfortable with, continuing it with you in this thread anymore.

 

I don't mean to be offensive. I just felt like I got attacked for something I wasn't actually trying to say. I absolutely do consider a trans woman the same as a "regular woman" for the record, it was a very vague and poor choice of words and I was intendng to make a comment on how feminism and misandry are not the same thing.

But you're right that my opinion on how this Portlandia skit affects certain people doesn't matter because I don't go through the same kind of prejudice.

 

I've lived in Portland my entire life. Fuck that show

 

I've never seen Portlandia, but I've always heard good things, so this is a little surprising to me.

 

Fixed your quote.

 

I grew up in rural eastern Oregon and pdx was def always the goal city to move to. This might just be cause I was young and didn't know what was going on around me lol, but as a kid I felt like I had this hidden gem city cause it was awesome but I rarely heard it mentioned outside of local news. Oregon was never really mentioned in any pop culture I consumed and I always wondered why. Then it suddenly felt like it was everywhere and a ton of people have been flocking there and it's steadily getting more expensive and I wonder if I'll be able to afford to move back there any time soon. It's weird watching the city I've always kinda put my dreams into change so much. /my semi-related novel

 

I've been watching these comments roll by for a while now, and i have to say that people seem to forget that cross dressing in comedy is not a specifically trivialized thing where men dress as women and make remarkably disparaging comments about trans individuals. Cross dressing in comedy or any other genre (i.e. shakespearian plays) is something that's played up by men and women (see Portlandia, or any improv organization at least) and is, in a lot of cases, satirical for the exact opposite reasons being displayed on the screen. Having a male/female duo that leads the skits kind of immediately lends itself to the absurdity that no matter what characters they play, it can only be one of the two actors. There's another recurring sketch that's been around since the beginning of the show where they each embody a member of a relationship of the opposite sex. I don't find the fact that Fred Armisen is in a dress to be funny at face value but the hypocritical satire of the sketches is sometimes amusing. Again, it's usually regarding feminism in general and never deliberately trans communities. I don't really understand the blackface comparison, as no one is making transphobic statements but rather one of the characters is simply portrayed by a man. Looking at the background of the two, the circles in which they run and their other working relationships, namely Brownstein's work on Transparent, It seems like the bigger issue here is the gentrification on the community and the shape in which they left the bookstore/the way they treated the inhabitants of the town.

 

Wow, apples and oranges. Black face is directed at black people. Dressing up as the opposite sex isn't inherently directed at trans people; you'd have a better shot at saying it's directed at woman. Even then, this whole movement to be a crusader for the downtrodden on the Internet is just hard to stomach.

I love tolerance and respect, but this social media "sanitation" of everything offensive so that you can tell the world what a holier than thou person you are is getting to be too much. I'm glad you found something that angered you and you did something to take a stand against it. But I know there all kinds of things you've done and continue to do in your life that aren't worthy of praise and are probably even shameful. How do i know? Because we all do shit like that.

My point is about perspective. There's a lot of injustice in the world, I don't think Fred armison's impression of a female hipster bookstore owner remotely registers as significant. Does it offend? Maybe. But not in a way that is meant to be vile. So can we agree that while acceptance of others is a wonderful thing, the notion that we have some inalienable right to never be offended in our lives is absolute horse shit?

The world isn't always rainbows and happiness. If you spend time letting shit like this eat you alive, life is gonna be pretty unpleasant.

Tldr: pick your battles

 

It was one of their first actions. New board was very recently elected. It wasn't a point as much as it was a statement of fact.

 

Is it weird that I think I could guess with almost prefect precision who the CIs white straight males are in the comments?

I'll make it clear: if you type some variation of "be less offended" to a marginalized group on my website you're not welcome here. Listen to them when they speak.

 

I hope my comments are not coming off that way. I am by no means trying to tell anyone to be less offended, I was simply reigning in some of the comments that seem to be losing sight of the issues here. I just personally feel like taking that one sketch and equating the cross-dressing factor to transphobic behavior was not necessarily intended by the show itself, whether it's perceived as funny or not, but I understand that it doesn't take intent to offend. I also feel like this is always a great place for discussion as long as everyone keeps a strong and open mentality, but I don't want to come off as one sided on that topic.

 

I came back in this thread, I read my posts, and I wanted to delete them all. Sorry for drawing so much attention to an unimportant point. That was a time I could have very well shut up and not prioritized my need to defend myself/my opinion over hers.

 

I would encourage anyone who isn't a part of the LGBTIQ community to read through this thread, especially those seeking understanding of why their opinion hasn't been met with the response they expected.

As to the comments regarding the common nature of portrayals of members of a different sex or gender within the context of "the arts" I think it's important to remember that prejudice has permeated all facets of human expression. It kind of disturbs me to hear a conservative cliche a la "that's how it's always been" or "but it's just one ____" be applied to any form of art.

 

People interperet things In different ways. My interpretation of the skit in question is that it is mocking the anti-men sentiment that can come with some expressions of feminism. Now im not really looking to get into a debate about what is and isnt feminism but as someone that personally sees a difference between feminism and misandry as someone stated earlier i found the skit satirical and mildly humourous for the first 2 times.

I love the show but i do tend to groan when those 2 characters now come up.

Crucially though as someone said before, being a non trans man im certainly not an authority on what is and isnt offensive to trans and non trans females.

Just remember people, the internet is a place devoid of intonation.

 

Glad to see men determining what is and isn't legitimate feminism. The way this discussion took place is the best argument for misandry, particularly against cis white dudes.

 

Or it's making fun of people exactly like them

 

Does anybody have any good articles to read about gentrification? It feels like the groups of people who have caused gentrification have the most to say about how much they dislike gentrification which I've always found fascinating. I'm interested in reading stuff from people legitimately affected by gentrification.

 

Totally. It's a bummer.

 

Wonder Showzen got around that problem quite well.

 

Haha that is true. It's difficult for sure, but absolutely not impossible.

 

same situation with Seattle. idk, if i ever moved back home i'd just live in Vancouver and suffer thru the traffic crossing the bridge into pdx. it's crazy how gentrified Vancouver is now

 

This show suffers from the same struggles that every sketch show has. Not every sketch can be hilarious. Chapelle's show, which is my favorite sketch show, had an unfunny sketch every episode. The good sketchs stick out and you remember those and the ones that suck you just forget about.

While portlandia often falls short on delivery they are tackling themes that don't get covered by any other show on television. Other sketch shows may have a handful of sketchs that cover "hipsters", but they almost always gloss over the topic and rely on decades old stereotypes that just aren't true anymore. Many of the plots in portlandia are things I experienced in my own life so I have a connection that I don't have with other shows.

I find all the sketchs with Kumail Nanjiani to be particularly hilarious.