The Last of Us (HBO) TV Show • Page 39

You haven’t given your thoughts yet just that link

 

the criticism of the above article (and especially some of the writer’s apparently now-deleted tweets) veers into vitriolic territory and there’s literally no need for it. the writer called Craig Mazin a stupid fucking c*nt or something to that effect in one of those deleted tweets (if what I saw was actually real), like to be that mad about it is just weird at best. to act like it’s a cynical gay cashgrab when it actually had heavy involvement from gay members of the cast and crew, and seemed to be something of a passion project for all involved, is especially bad faith coming from a self-identified queer person. especially when they’re saying shit like “we deserve better” (the episode is being celebrated by every queer person I know/follow, please speak for yourself) and trying to portray the game’s section as a “layered queer narrative” when it’s literally mostly told through entirely optional letters and the only explicit reference to Bill’s queerness outside of those is a gag where Ellie jokes about “sticky pages” in a gay porno mag she picked up at Bill’s place. you barely get any insight into Bill’s character at all and, if anything, he comes off as more of a caricature, while Frank gets an especially shitty end of the stick and is found having committed suicide by hanging and leaving a spiteful note for Bill. I think gay folks deserve better than THAT in the year 2023. the amount of bad faith in that takedown is unfathomable to me, personally, not to mention the writer’s whole demeanor feels smug and reeks of contrarianism. those are my issues with the critic’s work, not merely that they disliked it.

 

Yeah no fuck that

 

I am surprised how many people seem to have problems with the original Bill storyline. Of all the the third character vignettes in the original game, Bill's is probably the best one.

 

I don't have any issues with Bills storyline in the game, but I like the TV version more, simply because I don't think the constant set pieces would translate, and we got value added and nothing subtracted. I don't understand why people think character development was cut and it was a filler episode?

WHAT WE DIDN'T GET FROM THE GAME AND WHY I DON'T CARE

- BIll and Ellie don't interact so we lose out on Ellie personality growth - So what? we already get she's sassy from the previous episodes, and we got from the show that Bill is territorial and recluse. What's actually missing that would have been added by following the game? Nothing except maybe Ellie making a fat joke or 2 at Bill, and a lame cliche 'OMG the porno mag is sticky' joke. They still would have had to add in explanation for Bill to give a car to Joel considering how scarce the resources seem to be.

- There's a scene in the game where as Joel you're helpless (sort of), and Ellie has to chip in to help out killing infected till you can join back in - We didn't get that in this episode obviously, but so what? There's SIX episodes left if they want to add a similar moment. And judging by Ellie picking up the gun, let's just say I doubt it will go unused. She will be called upon to help out soon enough, and that's not a spoiler. That's just following the CONSTANT foreshadowing.

- You don't get some of the (non-spoiler language), infected encounters but again - SIX episodes are left. It would dilute them if there were too many. Plus the part in the gym would be kind of awkward to film. You want to watch Joel run around fumbling to reload and wasting all his ammo? We got that in episode 2. We will get all the exciting infected encounters in the show at the right time and they will feel more tense and meaningful.

- We don't get to see Ellie drive the car - Okay.. I'm fine with that. It made no sense in the game that she'd know how to do that, and it'd make no sense in the TV version that they've established.

What we DID get:
- A different type of queer representation that didn't rely on any negative tropes or their sexuality being a struggle or obstacle to overcome.
- Joel getting motivation to continue on with Ellie when all he wants to do is quit and pawn her off to someone else
- A plausible reason for them to have a car which is required for the events moving forward.

There's really not anything lost at this point that can't be added later, and the extra we got was well worth the shuffling around. I get why people might be a little upset at first, but if they used their brains, I'd say it's almost objectively better this way.

 

I played the original game years ago and have absolutely no recollection of the Bill character other than him being someone who gives you items. I can see why they changed it up and made that storyline more cinematic, I have absolutely no problems with that. I wouldn't claim he's a particularly memorable character from the game.

What works in a game may not work on screen, and vice versa. The show has added depth to what was a pretty one-note character from the game.

The criticism levelled at the show that it's not following the game beat for beat is odd. It's clearly an adaption of the source material.

 

The dog whistles from these articles are so loud, they might as well be fucking fog horns.

 

I don't remember the Bill stuff but I remember playing through next week's episode so apparently, I just forgot about Bill entirely.

 

also, love Rahul and that post. So well said.

 

If you want the exact same story from the game don’t watch the show and just play the game again.

 

You think a transgender writer is homophobic?

 

as someone who has not played the game I don’t want the show to stick too close to the game, half the fun of this shit is noticing and pointing out and analyzing differences between versions. movie adaptations of books that change things for the format are extremely common. kubrick’s the shining is good, king’s the shining is good.

 

I disagree with almost everything that article says

 

Do you think that’s impossible?

 

I don't know the writer other than the article I posted, which is not homophobic. I think it is more likely that the other poster didn't know the author was transgender.

 

I would not go so far as to accuse this writer of that, personally, but being a queer trans person myself I can tell you this is far from an impossibility. it’s unfortunately not uncommon for cisgender gay/bi/etc folks to be transphobic, for example, and tho I think it’s probably rarer to find examples of I have certainly witnessed homophobia from other trans folks. the majority, if not all, of us have some sort of internalized homophobia or transphobia to work through and keep in check, and you can’t ever really know how far along anyone is in that process. not everyone is going to be pleased with every piece of queer representation, and that’s understandable, but I can’t say I don’t find it a little suspect that the writer is taking such a vitriolic, cynical stance here when it’s such a positive and optimistic representation of gay love. at worst maybe it’s saccharine, but is that a crime? is it worth casting such bad faith judgments toward the intentions of its creators for that? I just don’t get that level of cynicism personally, and I would say I am a deeply cynical person myself in many ways.

 

It's perfectly fine to think a piece is cynical or poorly written but it is irresponsible to accuse or imply someone is homophobic without any evidence, especially since that person is part of the LGBT community. People can not like a creative direction of a show without being homophobic.

 

Straight cis white guy here but the fact that they're gay didn't...really seem important here? They used a nice love story to show how an outpost, so to speak, like theirs came to be over time, while also showing us how the main character of the show got into working with them, making said character and his companion's arrival there feel more powerful. The love story just happened to be two dudes instead of a dude and a chick. And the reason for that is because the characters in the game itself were apparently clearly together as a couple.

Also makes sense to kill them off before our main characters get there because in the previous episode it was clear the promise Joel made was to get Ellie to Bill's and let him take her. But obviously htat couldn't happen so.

 

Gonna watch episodes 2 and 3 tonight

 

can you point to me where I indicated that the writer is homophobic? I went out of my way to say I wouldn’t go that far. your question seemed to indicate an incredulity that a trans person could be homophobic, I was taking it at face value and trying to let you know that it is entirely possible for a trans person to be homophobic just as it is possible for cis gay folks to be homophobic.

 

Not you, the other poster.

Of course anything is possible, but there needs to be evidence. The author of the Vulture article criticizing the episode is gay. A gay author for Xtra liked the episode but did also say it was saccharine. People can dislike the episode without being homophobes.

 

What I took away from that, and also her being excited that there’s a shower, was that being clean and hygienic was such a rarity in those times. beyond not feeling ashamed, I loved how pumped she was at the prospect of being clean lol