Noah Gundersen - A Pillar of Salt (Oct. 8, 2021) Album • Page 11

Reality is not everyone wants to. We are bombarded as a society by other peoples drama, issues, conflicts, and so on, and some people look to entertainment as an escape. The information is there to be found, and that’s important. Some people remain indifferent either way.

Also, I think the point of that comment was to say they were ignorant on the topic, but did have an opinion on the deluxe. At least they are being honest and not trying to comment on topic they are not informed on.

 

Also maybe start by not referring to sexual assault allegations as "drama"

 

I find it odd when someone is accused of sexual assault (oh sorry, I meant “drama”) and then someone comes into their thread and is like “I don’t know anything about what happened, but the new stuff is really good” even though they are in the thread and can absolutely read the posts explaining what happened and have access to Google which will also tell you what happened. Just say you don’t care about what happened, at least you will be more honest.

 

I think to refer to the situation properly it would require knowledge, which out of the gate that person said they had none of (by choice obviously because the info is there an only page clicks back).

It would probably just be easier to comment on the deluxe version of Salt without even acknowledging ignorance on the allegations/statements released in a post though.
There is room in the thread to talk about all these subjects since they relate to the artist (music/deluxe and comments from both parties involved in the allegations).

 

I think it's ultimately no one's business but yours whether you choose to keep listening to his music or not, but I do think you should have awareness of what he's been accused of and how he responded to it. He definitely doesn't deserve a free pass and should be held accountable. And I say this as someone who probably wrote more positive words about his music over the past 8-10 years than anyone else on the planet.

 

Thank you. No one is saying you have to acknowledge it every time you post, but to bring it up in your own post and then dismiss it as drama when the context is literally just a scroll away feels callous.

 

It’s willful ignorance. It was unnecessary to even acknowledge in the context of speaking about music.

I’d rather people say they know nothing though and mean it honesty than offer an opinion like some kid of expert when they’ve not taken a moment to become informed.

 

Just some additional background… Pillar of Salt is probably the most meaningful album for me personally that’s been released in the past 5 or so years. It was released at a very turbulent time for me and it immediately resonated. The bonus tracks are incredible. I would honestly say that they may be the best I’ve ever heard in terms of bonus tracks. “The only Day” and “Pillar of Salt” especially. Hearing of the allegations and looking into them is disturbing and I know any kind of allegations along those lines are not to be taken lightly. But, we have a system in place that must be utilized, and if a conviction is made, that would be different. It’s easy to have a knee jerk reaction and assume that they are true. But I think the process has to happen first.

I am aware and it I hope that there is resolution for all parties involved. And If it does turn out to be true, then I will not be able to support him being that it is unacceptable to behave as such.

But for now, I just wanted to comment on how incredible I thought the extra songs were. Glad at least one person on here was unaware and now has listened.

 

Dude…. there is a big difference between an allegation and a crime. There was just a huge mainstream trial that highlights this very well.

that’s all I’m saying. Unless there was a conviction that I’m unaware of… in that case I am sorry. But I didn’t see that anywhere research wise

 

I just saw the Instagram post that was posted here (I don’t check Instagram) Doesn’t seem like a full admission of guilt and really only adds confusion to the situation… Does anyone know of the accuser(s) are prosecuting?

 

There are a number of reasons why hinging your opinion on “the accusers are prosecuting” might not be the best course of action. It sounds like she’s clear on the situation but conflicted on what she wants to do about it other than share her story. Even if she wanted to force Noah to take responsibility in the court system, realistically no one is going to prosecute given that the accusation is years old and physical evidence is impossible at this point. Check out the accountability in music thread if you’re interested in learning more.

All of the above is just to explain why criminal conviction is kind of a poor line for lots of folks in here. No one is saying you can’t enjoy his music; everyone has their own line and journey with this stuff. But I’d invite you to consider the way your general sentiment of “well he hasn’t been convicted, and he says it was consensual, so let’s just pretend it’s business as usual” has on the folks around you in a public forum when there’s a relatively traumatic story being shared in detail. She says in pretty stark terms that she was raped. Personally, haven’t been able to listen to his music since watching this video. It just doesn’t sound the same right now.

 

That was definitely not my main takeaway from that trial

 

That conclusion is precisely what I feared people would take away from that trial.

 

ffs

 

This really has nothing to do with Noah or his music, and more do deal with accusers and the fact their is value in using the justice system to try and expose people:

Jacob Hoggard found guilty of sex assault against one complainant, acquitted on two other charges - The Globe and Mail

Article is about a a singer named Jacob Hoggard, who’s the front man of the band Hedley. This just happened in the news a week or two ago.

 

Again, if the line you want to draw for yourself is "I'm willing to listen to this person so long as they haven't been convicted of a crime," that's your own choice. But don't be surprised if the discourse around that artist is not going to be what it was before allegations about them came out. I'll be honest and say that I tried listening to the deluxe tracks, because this album also meant a great deal to me personally, and it felt really strange trying to hear him the way I did before.

 

We can’t point to a single trial of a frontman and say “see look!” while ignoring that sexual assault goes unprosecuted every single day, even when victims try to prosecute.

You’re not even trying to understand. You’re just being an asshole.

Come on.

 

I understand and I think it’s a very serious and real problem.

I don’t think it’s right to immediately assume that every accusation is true. And I do get what people are saying about the prosecution aspect, but that makes it all so much more complicated.

 

I’ll have to check out that thread and learn more. Either way, this is all definitely disappointing.

 

The problem with this is that it then gets turned around that the survivor is being dishonest. I’d really encourage you to do more reading on the statistics of false allegations as well as how the legal system, starting at the lowest entry point of reporting to police, fail and further traumatize victims.

Also, I know people have already commented on this and I’m going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you’re having this conversation in good faith, referring to this as drama is incredibly dismissive and insensitive. You can just refer to it as a situation. Drama implies a flippancy and that this isn’t anything more than a “he said this about me so I said this and then he said this and then she said” so on and so forth

 

Thanks for letting me know about the deluxe version, and good on you for looking back a few pages and taking pause to take it all in.

 

I did not mean for it to be dismissive. At the time I had not looked into it at all. It’s obviously not just flippant drama.

 

No worries. Just saw that he has a graphic novel he is releasing based on his song Atlantis. Interesting.

 

You didn’t do anything wrong so don’t apologize. You said you were unaware. And there nothing wrong with you choosing to listen to his music. But now you can make an informed decision. I do feel that it is much easier to form defined opinions as outsiders when things are brought to trial, but not every victim is willing to relive their horrible experience and all the negative things that can come along with bringing forth allegations (generally speaking).

 

Why do you consistently try and absolve everyone every chance you get? He said he was uninformed and it’s not representative of how he feels. That’s fair and he’s said he’s going to look further into several of the things users here have suggested and we’re all moving forward. You consistently play some weird devil’s advocate when it’s entirely unnecessary and hand waves away any of the conversation that’s taken place. Plenty of users in plenty of ways have tried to discuss this with you. What’s it gonna take for you to actually look in the mirror