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I watched it for the first time, yeah a lot of it feels like your hip inner city high school history teacher trying to get on his students level and teach them in a way they can relate.

But there are moments that are truly revelatory and redeem some of the cheesier stuff

 

And even though rap makes up a generous portion of the movie, Phillips Soo and Renee Elise Goldberry’s songs and performances are absolutely stunning.

 

I guess I love corny rap

 

Corny rap is harsh. Not sure I understand what's corny about it.

 

For suuuure. “Helpless” was when I was like “Ummm what the hell?!” I immediately loved that one. Definitely my favorite of the whole thing. That’s the only song I can see myself listening to again.

 

The run of Helpless, Satisfied and a few after that is amazing. Hit after hit

 

I just think the music and storytelling are great lol. I get why certain people don't like it I guess

 

Upon repeat listens I've really grown to appreciate all the motifs that keep being brought back. But that's of course because I liked it enough to listen to it multiple times in the first place. I can definitely see it as a rap musical for people who don't listen to rap music because i myself don't listen to a lot of rap music.

It's received a lot of scrutiny recently for being a show about white slaveowners. Like, yeah, it's great that the cast is so diverse, but that's not really doing enough wrt representation anymore--it's groundbreaking for its time but already outdated now. I can still enjoy it, though; kinda like how I'm still a fan of Harry Potter even though its problematic creator's views are seeped into it.

 

Finally finished ozark

 

Has anyone watched Trial by Media. I watched the first episode and found it pretty entertaining/intriguing.

 

I watched it. It was entertaining and interesting enough

 

Hamilton was good. I think the first act was much stronger musically then the second, which is a shame, because the second act story wise was so much better. I think his wife was the best part.

 

That’s fairly common with musicals. Lots of the hits up front and then focusing more on the story and resolution later. Dear Evan Hansen is another recent one that comes to mind in that way.

 

Yep my exact thoughts too!

 

Dear Evan Hansen is definitely my favorite musical.

 

Is that one anywhere to stream? Does a recorded version exist even?

 

There are a lot of bootlegs, even on YouTube. No official release.

 

The soundtrack is incredible, I listen to it alot still

 

It is very funny to me when I see so many white people who probably got into hip hop through MBDTF calling Hamilton corny or rap for non rap fans, lol. The show is very good. LMM is a cornball, but a genius.

 

On the real though, the rapping is like the least interesting part of the musical. The melodies are great. Helpless into Satisfied, Wait for It. All good shit

 

No one else could have made Hamilton, not even the most well regarded rappers

 

Yeah that's what I find impressive

 

I'm interested in your thoughts on Hamilton if you care to share. Assuming you've seen it of course

 

I haven’t actually seen it in full! For years I tried to avoid as much as I could because I hoped to win the lottery or manage to see it on Broadway in a different way, and I wanted to go in as fresh as possible. Eventually I gave up on that and listened to it a lot and watched shows about it, but not the bootlegs or tour.

I think I would generally agree with preferring the songs in the first act, but it’s been a while since I did a full listen so my thoughts may have changed. I also totally agree that the importance of the show and the context around it coming out are pretty tied to their time and even though it isn’t that old it is certainly dated in many ways. The political landscape changing soooo dramatically is a huge factor for sure. But as a musical it’s definitely incredible and important and did a lot of positive things.

For the rap discussion itself, it’s sort of weird to directly compare musicals to the genres they pull from and are influenced by. Like they’re not meant to be listened to or judged exactly like an album, it’s a very different experience and intention. A fan of rock music doesn’t need to judge a musical with clear rock influences against their favorite bands, and the same is true for this or any other example of a genre.

Getting used to the idea that the music is telling the story and each song may convey a different emotion or thought can go a long way with starting to enjoy musicals, and especially trying different options to see what styles work more for you. I love them, but there are absolutely certain big shows or huge names that I don’t enjoy at all.

 

a movie is on the horizon