General Politics Discussion (VI) [ARCHIVED] • Page 1067

I don’t think being racist makes you incapable of stringing thoughts and words together

 

I don't even understand what this truck is getting at. I thought I maybe did, but I drew a (dirty looking) diagram, and I definitely don't.

 

it 100% makes you sound like that when you talk about shit. case and point: him saying white kids instead of wealthy kids. someone who isnt racist doesnt make that mistake. someone who is and makes that mistake and immediately corrects it seems like they cant string coherent thoughts together.

 

Except making blatant errors like that isn’t a *result* of being racist. Plenty of racist people are perfectly capable of hiding the ball, and Biden has been incoherent about plenty of non-racist things. Saying the difference between Biden and Bernie on that front is *because* of Biden’s racism is just wrong

 

thing is that was just him exposing what he truly thinks. that poor = black and wealthy = white. when people his age talk about "bad areas" theyre talking about black areas for example. that's how he thinks thus why he made that slip up. it aint that deep, hes a racist and said a racist thing and walked it back, it sounded incoherent but really its clear as day to me what he said.

 

Well, the general cliquishness and the pushback for out-of-group perspectives aren't terribly surprising, except perhaps in their degree. But because the community is focused around music, I wouldn't expect such monolithic social and political views. Noticeably left leaning? Sure (that describes me, too). But this highly activist, authoritarian, "you're all garbage human beings" keyboard warrior culture seems very disproportionately represented, relative to what I'd expect in a diverse group of music fans. And I think it's partially because anyone who falls marginally outside that gets driven out forcefully, at least if they make so much as one post on the wrong topic.

Ultimately, it's your site, and if you and the community in general prefer this culture then of course that's fine. It is jarring for someone wandering in just to discuss music, though, as opposed to being part of the social scene here.

But this is where we're at an impasse, because the epistemology that's baked into the consensus Chorus viewpoint on this (that MJK must be assumed guilty and canceled on the basis of what little we currently know) is almost certainly a fringe minority perspective in the general population. Why do I claim that? Because I've been reading a bunch of Tool stuff online the past couple days, and what's happening on Chorus is a complete aberration. Various music publications that reported on and know of the allegation are now covering the band normally. Beyond that, there's a board even larger than Chorus that has kind of an "SJW" reputation, and they had a long thread about the allegation... but their thread for the new single has 100+ participants without any issues. They do have some calm, rational discussion of the allegation, as is perfectly appropriate. Just no hordes of people who never liked the band anyway exploiting the situation for forum cred.

To bring this back to our discussion on the echo chamber, political allies, and all that: considering the starkly different judgment of this Tool stuff elsewhere online, and the fact that most people into music are left-leaning anyway, it's pretty safe to say that the pervasive attitude here is fringe. That doesn't in itself make it wrong, and I get that most of you sincerely believe it for various reasons, some of which I can respect. But your comment that I'm "diametrically opposed" doesn't make much sense. I'm completely open to new evidence, and I'm not trying to make excuses for what he did in the case that it actually happened. That probably does nothing to make me less abhorrent to you guys, but what it does is place me in that "adjacent 10-20%," because there are a TON of legitimately awful people out there who'd brush it off or make excuses even if the evidence reached Jesse Lacey tier. If you want to lock down a music community to a 10% fringe viewpoint out of militancy, that's one thing... but my original point was that it probably isn't wise in national politics.

 

love a good calm rational rape culture

 

"I'm sorry I don't believe women when they speak about abuse."

Dude, less word make better.

Like no shit Tool fans are willing to call it fake. BN die hard STILL do the same thing. R Kelly fans STILL do the same thing. Maybe people who stan for artists shouldn't be your metric for if an allegation is true or not.

 

You know you don't have to triple down on being a shithead, right? You didn't sign a contract or anything...

 

who be reading that lol

 

Okay but then you’re just talking about something completely different from what I was saying. It’s incoherence in the sense that he failed to say what we know he meant to say, regardless of whether what he meant to say is what he actually thinks. It’s not incoherence in that a listener is unable to cipher through how he came to make the mistake. The mistake exposes to us how he thinks, but someone his age with similar racist thoughts would be able to avoid exposing that if they were actually coherent and competent enough.

 

As a November baby, my parents totally fucked on Valentines Day 1983.

 

lmao fr

 

“Listen this tool message board filled with 45 year old white men don’t care about the allegation so chorus is an obvious outlier.”

 

No no. He said exactly what we know he meant. Freudian slip from racists often is racism.

 

For what it's worth I'm pretty sure I saw a study a few years ago that said racism basically turns your brain to mush over time.

 

I forgot Jack Appleby existed until just now he showed up in my Twitter timeline for asking how other dudes came to agree with terfs and their "feminism"

Jesus christ

 

jfc

 

You guys are focusing so much on that one specific example when there are so many non-bigoted examples of him just casually doing the same shit. Racism doesn’t produce “Go to Joe 30330”

 

i would disagree. i truly believe racism rots your brain.

 

Was that study called...Donald Trump??? Alexa play Real Time Bill Maher theme

 

Upon Green Book winning Best Picture... Biden is gonna be President?