General Politics XII World • Page 59

You can't just accuse me of lying and not actually say how. Please point out the half that is wrong/incorrect/misleading. As for "brushing off good points or rehetoric" there was none. None of it was good. No American politician except Tlaib has any good rhetoric on the conflict because none of them support the resistance.

I would also really like you to explain to me why it will be easier come January - do you think Kamala has signifcantly different positions on Israel than Biden? What has she said or done that would lead you to believe that? What can be done in January that can't be done now, under a Democrat?

 

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You accuse people of saying shit they haven't said all the time and don't thoroughly explain it lol. And yes in the post you literally just laughed off or wrote off good stuff he said with comments like "Good luck lmfao" and whatever else because you don't believe it's good enough to just say those things/think he's just saying it to say it or whatever.

And you know why, even though you don't like to admit to political realities because you find them to just be excuses or whatever. Whether you and I view it this way or not, a new presidential term and a new congressional term makes the elected pols feel like they have a 'fresh start' of sorts, it's why the first 100 days of a presidency are so hyped up and crucial to big accomplishments and why the first sessions of a new congress are always the busiest. I don't think this means something definitely will change, as I don't have enough evidence to think that based on what Harris has said. But I also think Harris has proven very reluctant to take nearly any position that differs with the current Biden Admin, on most every issue not just Israel, so I think the small possibility exists there that members of congress can push her a certain way in January when she is uhhhh no longer burdened by what has been. I do not think that possibility exists at all with Trump, and I think that's what Bernie's point is in that video. It's a lot easier to change policy at the start of a new presidency and new congressional term than it is during an election year. You know that, you don't like it, but you know it. Why pretend it isn't true just to try and score points? Because it's frustrating/sucks and we need something to happen now? Of course it is and of course we do. No one's arguing any differently there. But either you think Bernie is lying about what he's saying, or he really believes he has a better chance to help change things in the next session. Given how presidencies and congresses have worked historically, he's probably right that there's a better chance in January with a new president and congress. But not if Trump is that new president. And, again, I know this is all stuff you already know, you just wanted me to type it out once again so you can accuse me of being a lib or something lol.

 

if you're telling me, that a new or lets be honest, the same administration in office in 2025 will make things better regarding genocide amongst other things, you should be trying to do those things rn or well... for the past four years. then you'd have something to back that argument.

 

I think the "better chance" exists but is negligible enough that it might as well not exist

now what

 

If one is to accept that premise as true, a political system that makes it so that it can justify genocide for a year because “it’s just too hard to get things done right now/we’ll secretly fix it after the election” is indefensible and every moment of our political life should be about building something different and not ever running cover for the people who benefit from that system. If you feel like it’s just “political reality” (i dont, but i don’t feel like getting into all that) then isn’t completely upending that reality that forces people in need to suffer for basically like 75% of every decade - and hundreds of thousands dead specifically in this case - the only thing that really matters? That political reality forecloses on anything meaningful ever being by accomplished, and can be used to justify literally anything forever. One might even say it’s the largest threat we face, as it encompasses and encourages both Republicans and Democrats.

Beyond that, I maintain that Bernie and AOC are great examples of how marrying yourself to the Democratic Party causes you to get twisted into knots. I’ve not seen a campaign turn around and move to the left after they’ve been elected, really I’ve only ever seen the flip side of that. Especially on foreign policy issues. I think it’s wishful thinking to expect otherwise.

 

Did you really wish that though

 

i like to fight

 

wait so... since things can't be changed until the next administration, are you telling me all those stories of Biden being hard on Netanyahu trying to get him to a ceasefire was a lie?

 

We're back where we started because I disagree that it's "negligible enough that it might as well not exist", and of course when it comes to other issues, the chances of change are much larger and the differences between the two main candidates/parties stark enough, that I think it justifies voting. We will obviously not convince each other differently, but for lurkers, maybe they see why it's a good idea to vote or not vote from the discussion.

 

they been using redscare tactics. probably feds already doing things too.

 

Bernie’s response is shameful. It’s also shameful that he’s probably the best senator on Palestine rn

 

I have no clue who Ryan Girdusky is, but I'm sure he'll be a Fox News regular now.

 

I can go deeper into what I wrote off in that post, I didn't want to write 10,000 words.

First, if Bernie thinks America can stop West Bank settlement attacks he is delusional. There are new sanctions on WB settler terrorist groups, but they do nothing. If anything they embolden them. Bernie nor Kamala and certainly not Biden have acknowledged this or outlined what actions they would take other than ineffective sanctions on individuals. If he was serious about addressing WB settler violence he would be talking about sanctioning the state of Israel for openly skirting US sanctions in order to support settlers with money and arms, but no one talks about that. Until that happens there is nothing the US can or will do about WB settler terrorism. And this is not just Smotrich, Hilltop Youth is named after an Ariel Sharon quote.

Israeli settlers in the West Bank were hit with international sanctions. It only emboldened them


"When Kamala wins we will do everything we can to change US policy" - who is we, I guess? It doesn't include Kamala so I guess it's just Bernie? Bernie who refuses to call this a genocide, refuses to support BDS, votes for the Iron Dome and thought sending weapons to Israel was fine until they invaded Lebanon? I guess that is just not a significant change in US policy to me.

Do you really need me to go into detail on how any democrat who says "ceasefire" can't be trusted? how the "return of all hostages" is cynical hasbara? On why the problem is not just Netanyahu? On the complete joke it is to call what's been sent into Gaza "humanitarian aid"? These have all been discussed quite a bit in here.

Also, Harris has been perfectly fine breaking with Biden on trans rights! She said she'd codify Roe which Biden also said but hasn't made any effort toward, so is that breaking with the campaign? The idea that a Democratic politician is lying is very easy to believe but there is no reason to believe based on history that they would ever lie about their beliefs being worse than they actually are. When a Democrat says they believe something they either believe it or they believe something well to the right of it.

I do think Bernie is lying, or at least greatly exaggerating, about the chances of affecting a change in Gaza policy under Harris, because he prioritizes domestic issues and is a zionist. His goal with that speech is to placate concerns and get people skeptical of Harris but positive towards him to vote for Harris. Yes I believe he would lie to do that.

Well, you haven't made any argument about why the difference is not negligible. I've wrote a lot about it. So I am also fine with the lurkers finishing this conversation here.

 

He was on advisory board for Project 2025 and worked for Richard Spencer. Had zero idea who was before he outed himself.

 

i'm just glad there doesnt exist a hostages version of that dumb POW flag.

 

I wouldn't say it's "The only thing that matters", but yes it's a big deal and I think most here agree with changing the system, i.e. shortening election season, publicly funded elections, ranked choice voting, etc

 

I've seen him pushed into my twitter feed even before Elon, he's your basic conservative nightmare and he let the mask slip all way off last night at that round table lol

 

i for one think we need a few Ryan Girdusky's in our tent.

 

i too don't want to go through another 4 years of resistance cringe.