Brand New Band • Page 838

Serially abusive men with a history of grooming and sexual and emotional abuse make terrible fathers and husbands (from what he’s admitted to he’s a terrible husband already). The concept that a terrible, most likely unstable and abusive parent is better than a single parent is rooted in patriarchal ideals. Is your concern really his kids’ wellbeing or is it your subconscious instinct to back a man despite the fact he’s been given many second chances and keeps having unacceptable behaviour and playing into victim blaming, re-victimisation of his victims, and the overall decentring of them and devaluation of their stories?

 

He’s loaded. Brand New are loaded.

 

Serious problem here with people being so concerned about people being “respectful” or “nice” to such a disgusting human being as JL on a playform he will never read that they’ll get whiny about the anger of someone belonging to a population he routinely victimised. Check yourselves. He doesn’t deserve to feel comfortable, or welcome anywhere. Me saying “die jesse lacey you piece of shit” doesn’t have any real life circumstances. His multiple abuse of women and girls, his continued participation in rape culture and refusal to atone for his behaviour? Real life circumstances. Happening right now. Please stop, you’re all ridiculous. Tone police somewhere else. Respectability politics have nothing to do here. If you think they do, reread the victim statements and consider that it’s not even the worst that he’s done.

 

This is a good point

 

I personally don't think it's "tone policing" to say that speculating on certain people dying being a positive thing isn't adding anything of substance to the conversation. But then again I'm also opposed to capital punishment generally, I just don't think it's something that should be advocated for in the vast majority of situations. So agree to disagree I suppose.

 

the correct response on Jesse's part in this case would've been to not initiate the interaction like he did nothing wrong imo

I loved this band as much as anyone but pretending like anything Jesse has done in the wake of this has been positive is a massive delusion. interacting with fans like nothing happened is the farthest thing from holding himself accountable, and tbh he doesn't deserve any pleasant experiences from fans at all, not when that's precisely what led him to abusing his platform.

 

Have you met this guy? I think it is really out of line to call someone a terrible parent like that. My personal opinion... whatever his alleged past behavior is, don't bring his kids into it.

 

I’m wildly against capital punishment too, I just think that if he got run over by a truck it would be a great thing. Capital punishment isn’t what’s in question here. It’s a different context and a different discussion. We’re talking about power dynamics, violence against women, and the capilatistic patriarchal justice system was never going to punish men like Lacey anyway

 

He's an abuser and a parent, hence "abusive parent." Just because he isn't abusing his children (that we know of) doesn't make that title not appropriate. Also calling him an abusive parent isn't really a reflection on his kids, so that doesn't really seem like "bringing his kids into it" to me.

 

Something about you calling it “alleged” past behaviour (gross) or ignoring the research on abusive men being bad fathers informs me your opinion doesn’t matter one bit.

 

I find it fascinating to entertain the idea that a person's children can possibly be unaffected by their actions or the kind of person that they've shown themselves to be.

Maybe it's possible. Certainly hasn't been my experience. I will say that while I don't think it's appropriate to speculate about someone's children themselves, in the case of an abuser like Lacey I don't think that's the same thing as merely noting that their behavior is already part of the children's lives (which is what I saw happening in this thread). That's inevitable.

 

You’re right that is the much better answer to that question. I was speaking more generally towards the attitude that he’s not supposed to engage with fans. Realistically speaking what is he supposed to do when approached by a fan in public?

I appreciate the replies and for your take @EmmanuelSCastle I also don’t want it to seem like I’m supporting him or anyyyything like that. Just wondering what people think the appropriate and realistic action would be in this situation

 

"Thanks for being a fan all those years but we're no longer a band."

Seems easy enough if you're in that kinda situation.

I still can't get over someone wearing a Brand New shirt in public. I also think it's hilarious they think what was said is "cryptic ass motherfucker."

 

I don't think there's an easy or "correct" answer to what he should do. Given his complete lack of humility and refusal to even address the real issue here, I'm all for him being forced to wear a shirt that says "I am a moldy, uncooked potato who doesn't deserve your love and support" for the rest of his life. However, that won't happen. So at the very least, he could confirm verbally to fans that there's nothing left to be a fan of.

 

Yeah, once Anna said that it became obvious to me that’s what he should have said, for sure.
I am more asking what else would he be expected to do besides respond to this person who is engaging with him?
Agree fully with the rest of the comment, too.

 

1. I don't want to start a debate on the meaning of the word 'alleged,' but I think it is an important word and reminder to have in any discussion around people who have rightfully or wrongly had their careers and lives tarnished by public accusations without due process (note: I also understand there are many valid criticisms of the United States criminal justice system and why due process and justice is not always achievable in cases such as this).
2. Please share some links (or DM them to me). I am genuinely not that informed on the topic and am interested in learning more.

 

Also just to remind people that I wasn’t the one who brought up his kids. I’m not the one bringing his kids into it. Just sayin’.

 

Yeah no your opinion officially doesn’t matter here if you think this is relevant to the JL case

 

My issue with this is that it very clearly is saying you care a whole lot more about someone who has not had their life ruined, they're rich and living just fine, then the multiple victims.

 

"abusive parent" and "abuser" are two different things, are they not?... To me, the phrase "abusive parent" means the parent is abusing their child in some way. A parent who abuses alcohol or has a gambling problem is an "abuser," but I think it would be incorrect to call them an "abusive parent."

 

I don't.

What Are the Potential Impacts Parental Alcoholism Has on Children?

 

the actions of abusers have repercussions and those repercussions will affect his kids in traumatic ways. mincing words and trying to find a difference between abuser and abusive parent misses the mark bc abuse and the effects of abuse doesn't really look the same for everyone necessarily @stars143

 

Spicy hot take: people who abuse folks and when called on it demonstrate a complete apathy and reticence/refusal to take responsibility are already indirectly abusing their children because of the example that sets and the implications it sets and the other ways that behavior trickles down.

Especially if one of the abused was the spouse/the child in question's other parent - and in this case, that is absolutely the case. (Pathological lying and cheating is abusive. Being a "bad husband" is usually just dude-speak for "abusive".)

As both a childhood and adulthood survivor of every type of domestic violence (and substance abuse, since that was brought up) imaginable, I'm very confident in the veracity of this particular hot take.

 

I disagree vehemently, but I'm going to bow out of this thread after this post. I included the word 'rightfully' in my post for a reason. I am not trying to claim the Brand New singer is innocent.

I'm sorry my opinion doesn't conform with your worldview. Carry on...

I think my motivation for posting in this thread is that people are saying the world would be a better place if this singer/guitar player died. For all I know he has been to rehab/done marriage counseling/done whatever else to make things right in his personal life and be a better husband and father. Or maybe he's a giant asshole who is just lying low and living off his $$$ and hoping people forget about this in the next few years. I don't know (though radio silence from him or the band over the past few months isn't a great sign). It just personally makes me uncomfortable when people wish death/harm to others, even when those people have done very harmful things to other people in the past.

My morals and beliefs on reform/recovery/justice may be different from others -- sorry to stir the pot in the thread! I'm sure some of my posts come off more confrontational than I intend them to.

You're right. My post was a poor argument and incorrect.

True - my post completely missed the mark.

I completely agree with this. One thing I find missing from these conversations (at least the small subset I've been in or read) is what taking responsibility looks like. What does genuine reform/rehab/responsibility look like?

 

Wishing death upon someone isn't in great taste sure but uhhhh neither is abusing underage girls so maybe pick your battles