Brand New - Science Fiction (August 17, 2017) [ARCHIVED] Album • Page 1658

I just recently got into them. Where is the best place to start?

 

Curious when Kevin makes a comment on Warped's role in all of this.

 

He wont. He'll make some backhanded stupid comment about how much he donates and blah blah blah. He's just as bad as Alt Press and will continue to give these folks a platform until they quit making him money.

 

I wonder if this is causing any bands try and be proactive and discuss things that might come out to try and take action before they're publicly called out.

I doubt it, but I hope it's happening.

 

Cant be a great comment, he’s been relatively tone deaf when talking about the issue and doesn’t handle being called out for his support of abusers very well

 

I'd expect a tone deaf tweet.

 

Yeah I've said a couple things but it's really getting too much steam in that group and it's gross as fuck

 

I was just going to post something similar.

I’m mildly surprised we haven’t seen someone come forward in a proactive manner saying “I abused my position...” etc.

And not even out of a sense that it is the right thing to do. I’m surprised nobody has made the cold calculation that this stuff coming out is inevitable and it might be better for the them to have been seen as getting out ahead of it.

It seems someone capable of abuse would also be capable of self-preservation?

 

How exactly do people get into groups like this? This might be one of those moments where I'm thankful I'm ignorant of Facebook.

 

Warped World: The Reoccurring Problem on Vans Warped Tour

The statements he made regarding Jones' actions fall just short of disturbing; as he implied he felt the allegations were either not true or brutally blown out of proportion. Lyman stated in the interview with Alternative Press in 2015, "The word pedophile is a strong, strong term. While the world can be screwed-up at times, there is a criteria for things. In the court of the internet, people's lives are being dragged out in front of the world with no due process... It leaves a trail of destruction in other people's lives.... Are we going to go back to this Salem witch hunt mentality? Communication needs to happen. I am actively encouraging that if women and girls feel they are being victimized, tell your parents, go to the police, talk to counselors."

Warped's history is not good.

 

Because it makes no difference in the end. I don't care if someone is proactive about explaining how disgusting of a person they are or if they wait for it to be exposed as my reaction is going to be the same either way.

 

a few bands did though. a lot of these accusations were based on moments i bet the members don't remember or didn't see it the same way. it's hard to get out in front of stuff that didn't seem relevant to your life

 

I remember on the old AP site there was a whole thread about this. I kept up on the posts for a long time, but near the end of AP stopped following it...one thing I remember was that some people from the group were supposed to meet with Kevin. Do you know what, if anything, came of this?

 

As long as it's not Pinegrove I think I'll be okay.

 

Ok. It makes no difference to YOU. But I’m not comfortable saying it wouldn’t make a difference to a lot of other people. Or, more accurately, that someone with this in their past might make the calculation that it would make a difference to a lot of other people.

I think you could make the argument that, seeing how victims are being harassed, they might make the calculation that they don’t need to be proactive because they will still retain some fans.

But I’m sure there has to be someone out there right now, who suspects they might be the next name dropped, who is thinking to themselves “will I have a better chance of redemption if I preempt an accusation.”

 

I don't remember exactly.

 

If that’s true, it hasn’t really been on my radar. I admit that I’m not the most attuned to music news.

I guess I was thinking more along the lines of certain bands from the scene I grew up in.

 

Just have to have your request accepted by a mod, nothing fancy. But that group is such a shitshow right now nobody should want to get in lol

 

Lots of differing opinions on this question but I started with 2005’s THE SUNSET TREE, so I always suggest that first.

ALL HAIL WEST TEXAS and TALLAHASSEE both came out in ‘02, and are tremendous starting places as well.

 

There is no redemption from these things, though. None. Absolutely none.

 

Thanks! I’ll eventually get to all of it no doubt!

 

I can't for the life of me understand why people are having such a hard time accepting what happened as truth. Jesse's statement was about as vague and selfish as it could get, but I certainly read it as an admission of guilt. Kevin dropping off the shows, John Nolan's small statement and the cancellation of dates seems about as concrete as it gets to me.

It's been said a million times, but my thoughts are with the victims. Hopefully after this they can begin to move on.

 

I will gladly take money from some idiot who will still support this band

 

That's my plan. I'll take their money - hopefully a good amount of it - and give it to a group that works with survivors of sexual assault.

 

I mean, of course there is. Redemption is ultimately something each individual has to decide upon. It is not bestowed by some monolithic entity.

Each person decides whether they believe someone who has transgressed has redeemed themselves.

Now, what i believed you are saying is that you will never feel like someone who has done these acts can redeem themselves. Which is a sentiment I’m sure you share with many others. I’m not confident that a majority of people feel that way.

And ultimately, my whole point was that I am surprised that some past abuser hasn’t concluded the same thing. Given how much people seem to WANT to forgive their idols, that it might just be in their best interest to get out ahead of an allegation. And again, I’m saying not that this person would make that decision out of a moral awakening that what they did was wrong. But rather, as a cold calculation of the current landscape.

I think one of the obvious answers, provided earlier, was that past abusers just don’t see what they did was wrong. But I just can’t imagine that being true for all of them. I think it is more a...narcissistic thing? Perhaps they can’t brint themselves to admit wrong doing, even if they think it might help them in the long run, without being forced.

That’s the pathology i was really trying to get at with my original point.