General Politics Discussion [ARCHIVED] • Page 542

1) Do you think stuff like debt free college would be in Hillary's platform without Sanders?

2) The Sanders movement was never (or at least should never) have just been about getting Sanders nominated. It was (or should've been) about using Sanders nomination attempt as a catalyst for getting more progressive people involved in politics and elected in lower ballot races. Measuring the success of the Sanders movement based on how someone (who is not the person whom Sanders endorsed, btw) performs in the presidential election seems super dumb.

 

At least with Hillary as President progressives have a shot at being heard at all. With Trump, it won't even matter because he'll go "ooh what does this button do?" and start WWIII on inauguration day.

 

She really didn't pivot back at all from her primary stances.

 

From what I understand, they're attacking Stein from the right, which cuts against this idea of building a progressive movement. They're Hillarybros, for lack of a better term, who utilize bullying and gaslighting as a means to get people to fall in line. It's pretty disgusting and no amount of fear about Trumpism justifies it.

 

It still is trying to build a movement and accomplish from the top down instead of the bottom up which seems wrong to me.

Also when Bernie Sanders is supporting Hillary maybe don't use his name when describing the movement to vote Stein?

 

Speaking of Bernie, he and Hillary are doing a live broadcast on making college affordable at the moment.

 

She is just as likely to start it as she wants to continue Obama's legacy.

 

I won't put words in Trotsky's mouth, but, from what I understood, his point is that, if you're trying to attract left of center candidates to build a different political consensus, you don't use right-wing logic against them. That they have been is representative of the political culture of Clinton and her followers, and the extent to which they've deviated from Sanders' project. Also, the platform is largely meaningless. That it is used as a basis for voting for Hillary speaks to the desperation for something, anything, that points to the fact that she'll actually govern as a left of center candidate, as opposed to what we know of her historically.

 

Being "heard" doesn't matter. Obama "heard" BLM activists and the Pentagon is still sending military weaponry to police departments in the country. So, what is the actual point?

 

She's just lying, she won't actually sign it if it makes it to her desk. I know this because of something she said 20 years ago.

 

I'm pretty sure one candidate will be much better for POC than the other. And if WWIII is so inevitable, I'd rather have the candidate with the better temperament.

 

But Trump told me his temperament is his best aspect.

 

I need a running tally of how many times we can have the same convo

We must be at like 40 by now. We do this like twice a week

 

What good is temperament when most major cities are turned to ash and hundreds of millions are dead? WWIII will be a nuclear conflict.

How about you stop selling me on this binary choice like one will be so much better than the other?

 

Oh PLEASE change campaign managers again

I've never wanted anything more

 

History doesn't matter. Structural racism isn't a thing. Also, things politicians do in the past don't matter. For example, Bush left black people to die for five days, but wasn't it cute that he and Michelle hugged?

 

Trump : get me Ari from Entourage
Ivanka : daddy for the last time that's a fictional show

 

But, raisins...

 

Hillary is definitely not the best candidate we could've gotten, but Trump is definitely the worst. In any other election, I'd say go for it and vote third party. I personally don't want to risk it. You've already made your own decision.

 

Three to four times per page.

 

I'm gonna be so relieved when this election is finally over.

 

Yeah but it'd only happen once per page if Clinton was president instead of Trump.

 

I look at it differently, more hopefully. Bernie is evidence that a more progressive/left/whatever candidate can have success within the Democratic party. The voter base is moving left. The candidates have followed and will continue to.

 

serious question: trump seems so unpalatable to so many pro-clinton voters, here and elsewhere, that i am genuinely curious what the reaction would be should he win. the kind of hellscape described by people advocating for voting for her makes me wonder what the plan of action is after a Trump victory, do we organize and rebel? or what? what is the path moving forward?