Accountability in Music • Page 575

All these posts sharing a dozen tweets seem unnecessary at this point. If anyone is interested in following they can read it all on Twitter, after the multitude of posts here. At this point it will be disappointing to say the least if this is the band that sees all the harm from this tour and not the actual abusers.

 

They keep saying they want to hold them accountable and that’s the reason they’re doing the tour. How are they doing this though? It’s not like Dylan is going to be like oh I’m touring with a band full of people who want to hold me accountable so I must be on my best behavior at all times.

 

I believe the former bassist has become like a right wrong conspiracy theory racist nut job. What that has to do with Paramore I don’t know.

 

The Paramore comment is in reference to the merch design contest the band held

 

Fuck Proper. Support bands like Radkey and Meet Me @ The Altar instead.

 

I'm really torn about this whole situation because those initial tweets say something very true about carceral thinking in accountability processes. I do not think we should not take a one-size-fits-all approach to "accountability" wherein there is no potential for redemption, reintegration, and harm repair. That is the same "prison ward" lens that leads to the PIC justifying dehumanization and torture. This is an abolitionist approach to transformative justice and it's valid--I agree that someone like Dylan, who has caused harm and been called out for it, should be given the chance to pay restitution to their survivor and repair that harm, on their survivors terms.

I just don't think it's possible for Proper. to do any work of that kind while they are on Tiny Moving Parts' payroll. Even taking them at their word that they believe their presence will make the space safe, that's an obvious conflict of interest. They're going to make a lot of money on this tour, and there's no reason to believe that they'll be working with the survivor's best interests at heart here (and some of those follow-up tweets really cement that for me.)

This situation sucks because I think PIC abolitionist ideas and practices really need their place in these conversations, far moreso than they are. I think Proper. is obviously using them in bad faith to feel better about this career opportunity, but I really hope those ideas aren't getting thrown out alongside this all-time bad take.

 

What amount of money are they going to make opening for fucking Tiny Moving Parts?

 

More than they would make than if they were not opening for Tiny Moving Parts

 

Also, not once have Proper outlined what type of restorative justice the way will be implementing in the tour. They haven’t said shit about what they will be doing to hold Dylan accountable and make sure the shows are as safe as possible. To me it all sounds like empty words that won’t turn into real action once the tour starts.

 

Honest question: why do TMP and other problematics bands continue to receive dedicated threads when BN was removed or archived?

 

Yes, but it's not going to be "a lot of money" playing 1/4 to 300-cap rooms – certainly not enough torpedo your public image like this.

 

Yeah, it's not a huge amount of money, but any amount of money they stand to make is too much if they're claiming that their presence will aid in Dylan's accountability process, that's the point. They will in all likelihood make more money in merch sales if these shows are successful (completely disregarding the exposure from this tour turning into later sales down the road). Their financial interest is in a lot of people coming to these shows, which is a massive conflict of interest if they're claiming they care at all about whether or not Dylan repairs harm.

 

OK, yes, I do agree with this. I edited my previous post to clarify the point I'm trying to make – that this is not an opportunity worth having to do this whole thing for.

 

If, as they say, their whole deal as a band is to see reform and meaningful accountability, I would hope they've put some thought into strategies to make that happen. Now would be the time to share those strategies and lay out transparent plans and actions. Atm all I'm seeing is "my intentions are good actually!" repeated over and over.

 

His arguments barely even make sense. Not to bring another tweet into this but making claims like “what about the white people who enabled Ronnie Radke?”

is a stupid analogy when a lot of people dislike Ronnie and want to hold him accountable as well.

It’s clear that their mind won’t change on this unfortunately, although props to hey, ily!, Manae, and others who have been going back and forth constantly with Proper.

As for the threads being open, the Tiny Moving Parts latest album thread isn’t super active but it is interesting that Brand New’s thread is archived but TMP, Pinegrove, etc. are not.

 

man theyre still going?

 

i think they feel the need to keep arguing for their folly otherwise if they stay silent they’ll receive some kinda backlash they think would be valid (for keeping silent).

truly an interesting approach Proper. decided to go with. I just hope they learn something from this experience, whether it’s better communication on these matters or to actually see it from a victim’s perspective, etc etc self-reflection..

 

they just seem more and more like pieces of shit tbh

 

If they truly think what they're doing is "Laying down hard accountability", even after everything people have been trying to tell them for the last day and half, then they're nothing but a lost cause. You can't fix that kind of brain worms.

 

how is this nobody band doing opening support going to lay down accountability for the headliner lmfao. get your head out of your ass proper

 

proper lost a fan and supporter in me

 

300 bucks a night is worth selling out your morals and fans? damn that's crazy

 

They’re very much saying that it’s not worth it and making that money inherently makes them incapable of also holding TMP accountable like they claim they want to. Feels like everyone is misreading that comment

 

the BN thread became an absolute, utter, unimaginable dumpster fire, and iirc it was closed by request and i had initially thought that it was going to only remain closed until a decision was made on how to better moderate/facilitate conversations about abuse. no thread other than this thread has ever gotten close to touching how bad that thread got.