General Politics Discussion VII [ARCHIVED] • Page 1030

You’re right, I should clarify: literally all things between two or more people are “interactions.” By using “interaction” in my og post, I meant any conversation where there is no initial explicit or implicit promise of compensation.

 

No just that asking for it to be valued is absurd

 

This kinda spiraled into other stuff but last thing I will say about the FOB thing is that Joe didn't ask anyone for help, she voluntarily responded to his tweet and kept the convo going. And how does she expect FOB to pay her when she spoke to 1/4 members? There is a good chance Joe didn't even have a part in writing that statement lol

Idk, just seems dumb to voluntarily start talking to someone about a topic and then being like "I educated you so you owe me money" (actually apparently she walked him through the entire BLM ? What? lol)

 

It is after you've given it away for free without asking for any compensation. That's what volunteering is all about. Doesn't mean it doesn't hold value; it's a choice

 

Not all interactions are educational especially about civil rights and racism. I feel like you’re conflating the two on purpose.
when you say something ignorant online you aren’t typically entering into a “I want to be educated!” Position. But if you ARE an anti racist ally who DOES want to be educated, and you receive an education for free, AND you’re a rich white man? You should be paying up.

 

Yeah, a brand or company or otherwise powerful person being educated by someone without any power and then using those words to directly profit by improving their public image is such a different scenario from two random individuals talking casually online.

 

For the third time
No one is giving these women the choice because no one is fucking offering to pay? like you can’t say this when the choice doesn’t rly currently exist

why is it absurd to say “if this did help, my Venmo is ___” ?

 

That is not absurd and is totally reasonable. That is not what happened here, unless I missed something.

 

I like how it’s “defer to black peoples voices on things involving black people”
Until those black people are women I guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

It’s a little difficult to tell the sequence of things because it’s twitter and it’s all over the place
However the only tweet I saw that mentioned her Venmo name, that’s what it said verbatim.

I do believe this was after the tweet where she quoted the fob post saying something along the lines of “wow I just educated joe and they used my words and didn’t even pay me”. As far as I can see she was miffed that they didn’t offer to pay and then expressed why and said if I did help here’s my Venmo.

 

I don’t know what you’re saying here

Correct! And if you don’t agree to compensate for education then you shouldn’t have to pay! Glad we’re on point here

These are so many conditions that they completely undermine the much more general point that you are trying to make lol. So DON’T do this, UNLESS (1) you’re an anti-racist ally, (2) you do want to be educated, (3) you get a free education, (4) you’re a rich white man. Only after all four have been achieved does this law of contracts hold. I guess that’s not as ridiculous as the more generalized claim

 

we literally cancelled Cops, twitter!

 

I’m saying that your statement is falsely conflating by saying “oh ALL interactions are going to be commodified”
Nope. Educational ones are being commodified. Things that have always had value (education) being taken seriously for the value it provides.

Thats honestly ridiculous I can pretty much guarantee you’ve received a huge education from people who gave it to you for free and it’s wild that you don’t think any of it was worth $$ just because you didn’t specifically agree to it beforehand

like just say y’all think white people deserve black peoples time and effort to explain a problem we created.

 

whatcha gonna do when they (Twitter) come for you

 

Case in point: Most micro-transaction businesses / VC backed startups looking to do things like this (like pay me .00000005 cents for viewing a page on my website) are, well, VC backed cryptocurrency libertarians gremlins.

 

For me, as an individual black person, I think the frustration comes in part from the fact that black voices/causes are being spread through massively large corporate and white platforms - like Fall Out Boy, who because of their statement, will inevitably grow/retain their market share in part because of their education by black voices. The expression of "pay me for my labor in educating you" comes in part from wishing your voice as an individual with experiences as a black person meant as much as a white band with the ability to influence thousands of people. It comes with the recognition, that at some level, the difficulties and obstacles you have in obtaining a platform of that size is on account of your race.

 

Also for what it’s worth once again it’s not even ABOUT their specific interaction it’s about challenging the cultural ideas of value and subverting the norm.

the norm is that women and specifically black women have been expected to educate about their own traumas and do it with a smile on their face.
For free.

let’s unpack and talk about why that fucking is. you know if you claim to be radical you have to actually challenge the ideas that you have.

 

Education is literally the last thing that should ever be commodified!

people sharing information willingly is not something that should be commodified. The “debt” owed, if any, should be to take that knowledge and then spread it further

Do you just get off on being a total asshole? Is that what this is? Why do you continue making these completely condescending statements like this? You’re talking like some tumblr teen shithead and it is so both contrived and insulting. I really do not feel interested in continuing this conversation if you’re going to keep doing them, and I really hope everyone else in this thread stops entertaining them as well.

 

Will he go?

 

someone’s TIME spent educating should absolutely be commodified in the sense that they deserve to be paid for it?

I’m consistently pointing out that it’s not a surprise that you, as what I’m assuming is a white man, don’t understand the cries about labor that have been coming from women/black women for ages.

Really weird way to try and demean someone for reasons steeped in misogyny but gonna have to say this is where I tap out. Absurd that you’re going to sit here and call me names and demean me in an attempt to tone police me for...being condescending???? Okay dude

glad being “condescending” isn’t cool but calling someone names and attacking who they are because you disagree IS cool.
Lmao.

 

Lol this person is a clown, y'all. They don't want to convince you of anything. They just want to show you how much better they are than you, and how absurd it is for you to even dare question the logic behind what they're saying

 

"Like, just say you're racist and don't actually care" says the person also acting befuddled about being called condescending lmao

 

I’m a woman, which, idk, might be tied to the emotional reaction I have about women not being valued for their educational work???

I tried repeatedly to challenge people’s notions and ask questions at the root of the problem

If you think this is about me being better than anyone — I’ve literally never paid anyone for education outside of college. I don’t see how it’s acting to be above you to say that people should defer to black womens opinions on this

 

Little known fact, Pete's mom is Afro-Jamaican.

And to bring this all into this political world, here she and he are with Joe Biden:





(Not related, but this whole conversation just reminded me of Andy's early band Racetraitor -- which had some wild stuff in the early 2000s.)