Blink-182 [ARCHIVED] Band • Page 1462

So at best, he's not a bigot, he just defends them.

 

I only brought it up because I saw a few other people mention that they 'weren't sure' if he's racist or not and whatever. I was just saying I don't think he's a racist person because I feel like we would have heard some shit by now considering how long he's been around. But I don't think it's a bad thing for people to call out the problems with the shit he's posting without realizing the impression it could have on less mature minds. It's a problem or, at least, it could be a problem, and he needs to realize that you can't just endorse works that have that kind of stuff in it to your young fans. Especially in today's atmosphere where radicalization has become just a click away for young white males.

he's definitely like a picture perfect example of someone who maybe isn't individually racist but gets all pissy when you point out how some shit he does may either contribute to someone elses racism or even maybe contributes to structural racism.

 

like i said in the other thread matt strikes me as the kind of person that is open minded to a fault. imo probably has a lot to do w him growing up listening to punk bands like fear that had controversial imagery even for back then, and obviously wouldnt fly today.

some of the posts and choice of associates/friends ive seen matt make are very dissapointing and problematic. but in terms of him having racist views or anything of the like, ive seen him post/say too many things to the contrary to make me believe that.

 

It's very disturbing to me that anyone seems to thing, "just because he's not a racist, even though he defends them, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt" is even a thing. Racism, misogyny and rape are not "gray area" issues. It's also a really weird way of circumventing and purposefully not understanding the point. I don't care if he "isn't racist," if he is the type of person that allows racists, woman beaters and rapists in his space "as long as they're friends", that means I and many other people, can not trust him, the reason being, he values the company and opinions of those people, who are wrong in their views and actions full stop, over POC and survivors. That is the bigger issue going on. The tone-deaf complacency of it all.

 

It's frustrating having a conversation over and over again when what it comes down to is people having the privilege of not having to be the ones to worry about the type of people occupying their space and why. As a black woman, I literally can not give someone who would hang out with racists and rapists the benefit of the doubt because that puts me at physical and mental risk, the reason for cutting all ties is because that is something I can not stomach. It must be nice being able to brush these things off knowing it doesn't effect you one way or another.

 

honestly i dont mean to deny any of that. for the record i dont always have the luxury of brushing these things off either im a gay man and i know what persecution feels like physically and emotionally. i just have seen mutliple ppl in here insinuating that matt is a straight up neo-nazi, when i think the more constructive take would be matt is a person that is insensitive and irresponsible for carelessly promoting shitty ppl. i want ppl to be held accountable, but i also want ppl to be level headed in holding other ppl accountable.

 

Matt isn’t a nazi

 

I'd say it's counterproductive to the issue to argue the most benign assumption that misses the entire point, on top of trying to tone police the wrong conversation instead of focusing on personal accountability.

 

i honestly dont understand. i think were both coming to the same conclusion but in a way thats like glass half full vs glass half empty.

 

It's pretty simple. Worrying more about people calling him a racist and arguing about that rather than bringing the focus back to his actions is not the way to go if that is what you'd rather people focus on.

 

except thats not what im doing at all. ive basically been in line in criticzizing the guy for exactly what ur saying. i was only disagreeing w the more extreme conclusions from what a couple other ppl said before u entered the discussion. im really not trying to be an asshole here but at this point i feel like ur just strawmanning the shit out of me.

 

it doesnt matter one bit if he’s ‘not a bigot’, supporting problematic artists/abusers and doubling down over and over on it/them is just as bad.

 

Matt has extremely boomer “fuck your feelings” energy which sucks, it would be good if he could just be a human and say “wow I’m sorry that my post made you feel that way, thanks for sharing your perspective, I’ll take this as an opportunity to learn”

 

Maybe it’s just where I’m at mentally lately but while I found some of the discourse rude and militant (as per usual,) I feel like this weekend was more good conversation than bad (which is less than usual, in this forum at least.) I appreciate those that were more level headed and less condescending to those of us willing to listen and learn.

 

I don't like when people blame this site like "Oh, we can't even have a civil discourse on this forum" because we're WAAYYYY better than Twitter or whatever.

 

I think this discussion has been more than civil, but i think there are a lot of points being missed.

 

I don’t think anyone is missing any points being made? People are being told they’re missing the point and they are made to continuously point out how they’re not. I’m not sure why there needs to be some hierarchy of morality here. Blink isn’t for you anymore? Cool. No need to be arrogant about it and condescending to those willing to listen and learn. No one is defending Matt here at all. Our reactions and disappointment with the band are going to differ from each other. Why do we have to tear each other down about it. How is that constructive at all? That’s weak.

 

I don’t mean to personally single you out, or really come at your reply in a challenging manner, but I think this issue is much bigger than Blink just not being for you anymore. I don’t think people are reacting this way just because they don’t like Blink (maybe some are, but I personally am not). And, while I don’t think you specifically have done it, there are absolutely folks in here defending Matt, which is a bad look. Like, I read a post that basically said “Matt’s a weird guy whos into weird stuff”, like, come on….that’s not a good way to look at this or justify his behavior. My issue with this is that this is like, maybe the 3rd or 4th time in like the last few months that Matt has said or posted something that lends to the belief that he’s a shitty guy, and it’s so disappointing that Mark just stays silent on it all, but when people come in here to voice their opinions against it, it just gets written off as people talking shit about Blink, when there are much larger social issues looming. Matt has time and again proven that this is just the kind of person he is, and, I just think the dramatic history of Blink fans vs. non-Blink fans on this website clouds up discussions about this.

And as far as points being missed go, what I meant by that is that people keep trying to come back to "well he's not a racist/nazi/bigot" (which is also a defense), and thats not the point at all of what is being discussed here. None of us know him personally (that I am aware of), who knows if he's really a bigot, i like to think he's not, but the point being missed is that that doesnt actually matter in this discussion, his online behavior lends to the belief that he supports/condones folks who ARE.

 

I feel like we're all, more or less, fundamentally on the same page now, which begs the question, what's the sound, reasonable action we can all take to make the blink community a safer place, and ethically consume music that Matt is involved in?

 

I appreciate this response and you’re not wrong. I think I interpreted those posts not as a missing of the point but a circumnavigation or, like others have said, a justification. Maybe that’s six in one/ half dozen in the other but I think my mind separates those things. I’m upset with Matt. I’m upset with Travis. I’m disappointed with Mark. It’s when on that level I feel we’re all on the same page like said above, but our reactions to that differ and I don’t like being made to feel like I’m a bad person for still being interested in listening to their music as if I’m ignoring those things. I’m still coming to terms with how I’ll react. I’m still listening to hundreds of OTHER bands. But blink has been a large part of my identity for so long that I’m going to participate in the discourse when it comes up. Again, I appreciate the response. It felt like a real response.

 

I feel like I’ve been hearing more about simple plan in the last 6 months than I have in the previous 15 years. Are they “back?”

 

They have been touring pretty consistently, but I think they are recording new music now.

 

I live in Quebec and I barely hear about them anymore so I don't think they are. I was very surprised to see their singer being featured on the upcoming Silverstein album.

 

why can’t the answer be to not consume the music? And I’m not being snide. But how else do you send a message?