Brand New - Science Fiction (August 17, 2017) [ARCHIVED] Album • Page 1682

The songs, bands, moments etc should mean to you whatever they mean to you. Honestly, I see mostly men in this discussion talking about how this music was noninclusive of women. Then, a woman stands up and says "i felt included and even though the song was about a female, I still related it to my life". If I'm understanding you, you're being made to feel like you weren't supposed to feel included or you were duped into feeling a connection to the music. That's ridiculous and unfair to women to make this case that those songs were about one thing and only meant for certain people.

I think maybe the severity of what has been happening in the scene and the world has been making it harder for people to accept grey areas and nuances

 

just saying that you're not going to listen to them anymore or give them a care just would allow them to go away and not do anything else. I think that we need to set a process for what they need to do, whether you forgive them or not. it's really not about us fans, it's about the victims and we need to hold them accountable.

that tweet kind of sums up what I was thinking

 

Like Jason said in a post today, I am extremely disappointed in the other members of Brand New for still not releasing a statement. I think their silence really says a lot. It shows a total lack of any attempt at empathy for the victims.

And now, when I think about their "mysterious" and "enigmatic" ways (which I used to find intriguing,) I just feel they were that way because they've always had something to hide.

 

this might be my favorite discussion on the site so far about this whole situation. figuring out how to handle situations that come up in the best way possible is something that everyone needs to think about, let's look forward and build as a community instead of just looking back

 

I think we're getting over the initial shock of it or at least I am , and seeing how widespread this type of behavior was/is and what we can do to fix it.

before last friday I never even thought about these types of things in this scene, mainly because I'm not really in this scene anymore, only started paying attention because of Science Fiction being released so it's been a very strange 3 months.

 

Yep, that's a lot of it. Feeling left out because the scene WAS hard for girls is bad enough, but to feel like it was also wrong of me to relate to this music on a personal level adds another layer of pain to the whole thing. When the articles trying to build up women in the scene only talk about the lyrics from the male fan perspective and leave out the female fans who loved them too it just makes that guilt about supporting any of them even worse.

 

While I agree with you that is heartbreaking, especially for the victims, is really our place to "set a process for what they need to do"? I mean, isn't that basic common sense? Don't Lacey and Brand New understand that? Do we really need to set anything that they should do? Shouldn't them be able to realize that by themselves? The way I see it, the faults of his blanket apology followed by the rest of the band's silence said more about them than their whole music catalogue.

I'm more in favor of empowering the victims and voices like the ones that speak up today from the scene about this whole thing. That's more empowerful and says the message that both his victims and fans and ex-fans need to hear/read/signal boost.

 

new story with more details:

Brand New’s Jesse Lacey Solicited Child Pornography From a Teenager For Years

 

It wasn't wrong of you. A lot of people related to their music, all of us here did. It's not your fault, but I feel like the authors that talked about the situation feel the same you are feeling. We are all feeling like that, because we all projected that on them. Just like it's hard for you to read that piece, it's probably equally as hard to the women writing it. You will be fine. We will all be fine.

 

yup. that's the problem with this whole thing. jesse has done nothing to even be accountable

 

I don't know. I don't think it is common sense because nobody knows what to do apparently.

The silence is speaking volumnes, but I was more commenting on you saying to you it's just "fuck you jesse lacey" and that was it, like it's over after that. There's more that needs to be done than just dismissing someone

 

How can anyone think to defend him at this point? He doesn't even try to defend himself.

 

I guarantee you are right. I wish that entire subreddit could get banned along with incels.

 

I can't deal with Jesse Lacey's shit. I don't understand why I need to do more than "Fuck you, Jesse Lacey" and listen to the victims and empowering them. I'm doing out of guilt for having supported his band, by the way. I don't need to teach him how to act, or Brand New for that matter. If they can't sort their own mess out, what should we as fans do? I mean, more than literally filling pages and pages of message boards how it'd be to act like a decent human beings and not take one full week to speak directly with their fans where the rest of the band stands? I don't know man.

I'm a lawyer, that's my day job. Every now and then divorcees asks me if I can do anything to "force" their ex-husbands to be more present in their kids lives. The truth is I can't. Explaining this to people is hard, and rules for parental alienation aren't as advanced here as in other places. I can try increase the kid's child support, but I can't force or teach someone to be a good human being. Same rule applies here imho, and with the caveat that the only accountability that I can give to Lacey is my fuck you. So there's that.

 

Haven't seen this brought up here, or anywhere else, but is it possible that any statement released using the term "victim" can be used against him/them if anything were to go to court. Because if there is a victim(s), then there is a perpetrator. And if he or they release something that were to include "victim", it could be construed as an admission of criminal activity.

 

I don't want to speak for EAS, but i think she may be saying that she didn't/doesn't feel that way about the lyrics and is being told she's supposed to and feels guilty for not.

And in doing so, I just spoke for her. Sorry

 

I don't think the word "victim" implicitly describes legal wrongdoing so I doubt it

 

You can write something without using that term that would pass a lawyer's test and get the message out; however, as far as I know zero of the people that have come forward have said anything about wanting to pursue a civil or legal case against him.

 

Ha, thanks. Yeah it's a complicated feeling to explain for sure. I just feel like any time we talk about those lyrics and don't bring the legions of girls who identified with them into the discussion and what that means to them years later and instead paint them all as obviously gross and harmful to everyone it just leaves us out again. Like the lyrics themselves aren't why I suddenly can't bear to listen to these songs, it's knowing that I gave credit where it wasn't deserved and that the context of the songs I perceived wasn't what was actually happening.

 

I have mixed feelings on that. For instance, Rihanna seems to have forgiven Chris Brown but he'll forever be a piece of shit to me

 

it happened...was just at happy hour with a few friends and Jude Law came on...

it was too weird.

 

Completely ignored what I was saying but cool.....

 

A bunch of dudes getting mad at the notion men aren't really feminists is too ironic


As a rule of thumb, if anyone calls themselves a male feminist, they're performative at best and a straight up predator at worst. Men actually fighting the good fight don't need the label for validation and shouldn't be seeking it

 

yes yes yes

 

I mean I'm a woman though, but I get your point about the performance.