Sexism/Feminism/Womanism Discussion Thread Social • Page 3

I put my bra on one boob at a time like everyone else

...I did not know that

No no it's totally okay! I've just seen a lot of people dropping in to say "sub" and such. I haven't really said anything because I feel like a snob doing it.

 

im surprised people didnt know this! ive been in multiple arguments on ap about it too hahah

 

Haha, it was under the "Options" tab at the top of every thread page.

 

It's great you did that. I felt stupid even making that post into a thread of this serious nature but didn't look around to see if there was that option. I appreciate it!

 

Yeah it was the ultimate way to lurk threads. If I didn't know how messy it would get I wanted to keep an eye on where it went before I posted lol. It was an essential feature!

 

The slight gap in the stuff like per diems could probably be rectified by the US authorities but does the Womens World Cup even generate enough money for FIFA to pay the ladies the same amount as the men get as prize money? I think payment in sport is a pretty difficult issue since there's such a discrepancy in the money generated in both so it's not exactly comparable.

 

This link might help out a bit. Good piece on the issue.

You're right, it IS complicated. But even a statement such as "did they generate the same amount of money as the men" is a complex one because you can't have that conversation without addressing the misogyny behind the amount of revenue brought in - women's sports are inherently devalued.

 

Yeah. How do we increase the value of womens sport though? I think I read something last year about how the Womens World Cup had barely any sponsors at all even though the ratings and attendances were pretty good. If the men are generating 5 billion like that article says though then it's understandable they're getting more for the time being.

Until the quality of the female players increases it's going to be difficult to create a similar level of interest as the men's game worldwide though. (I say this as someone who watched every single game of the last Womens World Cup.) I guess it's all about increasing the participation of kids which would EVENTUALLY lead to better players. Maybe bigger prize money would help incentivise them too.

 

The value of women's sports has nothing to do with their quality. The bases for it being devalued is patriarchy and its cultural exports of sexism/misogyny. So, rather than assessing it on its merits, the worldview it has produced treats it as sort of a sideshow to "real sports",eg, men's sports. Even the way in which we analyze their skill is predicated on patriarchal epistemology. Giving them equal pay, then, isn't something that is undeserved or even rooted in performance, but one element within one sphere of recognizing the equality of women. More than that, structural inequality has benefitted men for thousands of years, conferring upon them unearned legitimacy, so let us not act as though the current state of affairs is even based on "men being more entertaining" or whatever other justification people might trot out.

 

...what games were you watching? The men's team didn't even make it past qualifying rounds and the women won. The sportsmanship and skill isn't the issue here. I am unclear as to how you can make a statement like that without seeing the misogyny behind it.

Do the female players play the same way the men do? No, they tend to only fall down when somebody actually fouls them and oh yeah, they actually win games. Where are you coming from with this?

 

Increasing the value and interest in women's sports is definitely a complicated issue no doubt, but I'll have to disagree with Moose's statment in regards to it linking it to "quality". I think the only thing these sports need is increased marketability, accessibility, and equal time. Just look at how much publicity MMA has gotten over Ronda Rousey. Women's soccer blew up because Hope Solo, Carly Loyd, and Alex Morgan became household names. Now if you want to argue that a woman's sport needs a superstar in order to increase interest, I can buy that, but that's only because that's true with male sports as well.

But yeah, I think equal marketing and accessibility will go a long way.

Women's basketball is the only conundrum I can't figure out.

 

Sorry if I came across as an idiot. (I probably am). I wasn't talking about the USA men vs USA women in terms of their success. I know the USA women annihilated everyone. I was talking about the quality of the football in the tournament as a whole as far as a spectacle for a casual viewer. Like asking why SOME PEOPLE don't value women's sport, which is because the players "aren't as good at it as the men", and they're tuning in expecting a similar thing.

I actually typed a similar (but wayyyyy less eloquent) thing to what Dominick said about needing to assess it as its own thing and not compare it to the men's game but deleted it cos I though my post was too long haha.

 

I see. No worries. I wouldn't worry about your posts being "too long" if that length is what's necessary to get your full point across.

 

Yeah. My fault. I tend to only jump in the politics threads just to read and learn and maybe ask an occasional brief question rather than trying to ramble through 8 paragraphs . I'll try and be a bit smarter.

 

Good news in Canada today!!
P.E.I. moves to provide abortion services on the Island

 

Men are generally better at sports. Lmao this isn't sexism it's biology.
Why do you think female national hockey teams don't practice against NHL players, or even lower leagues? They practice against like college teams or something.
So, the men's sport is more entertaining to watch, which means more people will watch it, which means more money is generated, which means the females earn less. It's simple.

 

Men are "better" at sports simply because the status quo for a long time has been that sports were a male thing, we got the benefits and reaped the rewards of making them men only games.

 

You're arguing against basic biology. The best men in the world vs the best women in the world in a physical sport will never even be close, sorry. It's not sexism. Men and women are built differently.

Now, when it comes to different sports like volleyball or whatever, the playing field is probably more level. But in sports like football, soccer and hockey, a team comprised of the best men in the world will always demolish the team of the best women in the world. Is it possible for a good women's team to beat a bad men's team? Yes. Are ALL male athletes better than ALL female athletes? No. But you people are making evolution a sexist issue and it's sad and pathetic

 

"sad and pathetic"? Not even going to give you the time of day.

 

Just wanted to say that I think you should really try to reread @Anna Acosta's, @Dominick's, and others' posts on this issue--you're not saying anything that they haven't addressed directly and I feel like giving them another close read might help illuminate some points.

 

Unfortunately, women simply aren't equal in terms of sports involving physical exertion. This isn't sexism. Put a top female fighter up against a top male fighter and see what happens.

 

What's there to understand? Men's sports are far more entertaining, because men are better athletically. Biology.

 

@Kev saying "this isn't sexism" over and over doesn't make it true, repeating something does not equal backing it up.

you should really think about the implications of immediately making physical brutality of men against women part of your defense.

 

Are you stupid? I'm saying men are better at athletics, which makes it more entertaining, which means we throw more money at it, which means it is valued more.

 

This is a shocking and scary post.