Accountability in Music • Page 565

'virtue signalling' ok pal

 

Nah, people on this site have a real problem with only seeing situations/people as black and white and having a complete inability to take in complex situations and process them as anything other than "this person is inherently evil because someone tweeted something negative about them". It's regressive and I can't see any reason why you'd choose that outlook for a purpose other than insecurity or trying to look good.

 

you are literally the worst offender of doing this, I'm sorry but it's just true lol

 

would be hilarious if nobody signed this washed-up right-wing shithead

oh there I go virtue signalling again, oops

 

Look I just find it a little bit strange to be throwing around "scum" and "irredeemable piece of shit" to describe like... music critics who say some tone deaf shit or young musicians who are mostly doing a net positive but have been uneducated at times. It's strange to try to aggressively (and abrasively) come off so high and mighty about these things, especially since the vast majority of the world wouldn't even notice. This doesn't apply to like, Morrissey or Marilyn Manson or anyone else who has been purposely hateful or abusive. I just don't get the appeal of jumping on the bandwagon to call Ian Cohen or Yungblud or any number of other mostly-harmless people named in this thread horrible human beings. There are grey areas and mistakes people can learn from, which is just often very much neglected in here and distracts from actual issues. Humans are complex beings and by neglecting to realize that, we just use the idea of "accountability" to be cruel.

I think that's pretty reasonable and if people here think I'm problematic for saying it, all I can really say is that's part of the problem. I used to be like a lot of the people in here and rush to call anyone an awful person, but after some growth and real-world experience I've realized it's just not a sustainable, compassionate or healthy way to be.

 

sorry I get heated about matters in this thread every so often I guess??

probably just not gonna bother with this place anymore, you’re better off

 

Great. Another non cishet man bullied off this site.

 

what the fuck does this even mean? if they make music you like they get a few free passes?

so, because a lot of the general public doesn't know about it or would never know about it (re. Pinegrove, BN, etc.), we shouldn't talk about it or hold artists accountable for shitty/abusive behavior? if there's anything in my life i'd choose to be "high and mighty" about, it's calling out abusers.

Glad you draw the line somewhere I guess

I've seen some bad attempts at defending abusers on this website before but this really tops the list.

It's not

Problematic people saying that being called problematic is a problem. Sunrise, sunset.

 

Not referring to Brand New or Pinegrove. Has nothing to do with what I like and don't like. I've never seen anyone miss a point this hard but I don't know what else I could have really expected from this site

Why are we referring to everyone we don't agree with as abusers? That's the thing that really does not make sense to me. People like, as I said before, Ian Cohen, Yungblud, even Anthony Ronald McDonald and Matty Healy (or literally any artist that made an NFT I guess?) aren't inherently "abusers" because they said stupid shit (that most people wouldn't think about or take to heart/be influenced by, which is what I meant by that part. Not that we shouldn't talk about Jesse Lacey being a literal criminal because other people wouldn't know about it yet). It makes sense to bring transgressions to these people's attention, yes. What does not make sense is saying they deserve to be deplatformed and anyone supporting what they do is problematic/a bad person. That's unbelievably black and white and intolerant.

I've frequented this thread over time because this site was the only place to say literally anything about JJR and a few other actually awful situations that pretty much everyone else turned a blind eye to, but it's really turned into something else that seems self-serving to me. If I'm wrong I'm wrong, but the accusatory and inflammatory reaction I'm getting rather than reasonable discussion pretty much confirms what I'm saying.

 

The people who want those that actually care about accountability to shut up are the most self-serving of all, in my experience. If you want a safe space where your favs are free from criticism go post on Reddit.

 

No one that I've mentioned is even remotely close to "my fav". I don't really care about any of them frankly, once again needlessly accusatory

Implying that I don't care about accountability because I feel like equating saying something tone deaf to being an abusive person is a problem? All I'm gonna say is that some of you seem too detached from the real world to even know what you're upset about at this point, and this is gonna be my last post on this website.

 

I don’t disagree with everything you’re saying, but in the effort to have a reasonable conversation here, I’m curious about this point. Why do you think people like Jesse Lacey deserve to have a platform still?

 

you came to the wrong site for nuance dawg

 

I literally didn't say that what the fuck??

 

you said that last post was gonna be your last post

 

zero people to my knowledge have called ian cohen or anthony Ronald McDonald “abusers.” however, they deserve to be held accountable for things like, say, diminishing a singer’s public depression and their lyrics before said singer killed himself or equating midwestern factory workers with numbskulls or flirting with the far right. thus posting about them in the accountability thread. there is a spectrum for these issues, which deserve to be discussed on this site, and here in the thread specifically for discussing them. you really, really, really do not have to be this fucking stupid lol.

 

Jesse Lacey is horrible, he doesn't deserve a platform. JJR is horrible, he doesn't deserve a platform. Morrissey is horrible, he doesn't deserve a platform. What I think is wrong is equating a fucking Pitchfork writer who said something dumb and classist and later apologized for it to these people. And I grew up being a bigger fan of Brand New and the Smiths than I ever will be of any journalist or Yungblud or the 1975.

Literally everyone close to me is a victim of abuse, this is a topic I care about immensely which is why I've been part of this thread in the first place. Everyone just reads what they want to read because having someone to dunk on is appealing

 

I swear to god reading comprehension does not exist on this website.

 

it indeed does not

 

Maybe I’m misinterpreting? You said the part I quoted immediately after bringing up Jesse, so I thought that’s who you meant. Apologies if not, I’m really not trying to be hostile.

My general thoughts though are that anyone who has said/done problematic shit *does* deserve to have that platform taken away like, 99% of the time. There are exceptions to this, Steve posted the other day about how Camila Cabello has turned her platform around and is using it for good. That’s great! But in most of the cases we talk about here, the artist is too small to really make that difference, and honestly don’t put that effort in. So it makes more sense for them to just go away forever.

 

Calling these people "absolute scum" and demanding them to be deplatformed isn't holding them accountable. Ok I'm done