General Politics Discussion VIII [ARCHIVED] • Page 1043

This dude knows absolutely zero teachers. They will straight up throw bad/unethical teachers under the bus

 

I was surprised that the startup my dad works at didn't take advantage of PPP. He started looking into it for them, and they decided they had enough cash in the bank and didn't want to take away from others.

Although I wouldn't be surprised if some of that was just a concern of getting bad PR lol.

 

Yeah I can't think of a single instance where a union or teachers in general would defend a teacher who sexually assaulted a student. At minimum a teacher may be able to get a lawyer through the union but the union itself ain't gonna be able to protect that person from losing their job

 

Isn’t the stereotype that unions protect lazy/bad teachers? Which, that’s the same stereotype about literally any union. To think that that means the unions will protect child molesters is just...I don’t even know man

 

Youtube needs to flag and delete. He's doubling down.

 

I 100% agree, but if you read the thread that's not what he's saying. He's talking about electoral messaging and using same-sex marriage as an indicator of successful electoral messaging. It simply wasn't.

 

Yeah I mean, for all of the flaws with it, civil unions actually were an important stepping stone to getting more people to just accept the marrages.

Our state legalized civil unions and then like 2 years later did gay marriage hah

 

That wasn’t because it was a necessary step it’s because the activists kept fighting because civil unions weren’t good enough.

 

It absolutely was necessary to get more normies to accept it. The small steps help shift pubilic opinion as it continued to help "normalize" gay people in society as being just like straight people and just as deserving of straight people of all the same things. That didn't happen just because activists convinced people it was true.

 

They just came around two years later lol? No. Same sex marriage was electorally popular, they did a half measure, and people said no that wasn’t good enough.

 

Also this comparison is kind of stupid. The same sex marriage fight is not a great analogy to policing. The point was that you should continue to fight for things even though they aren’t perceived as popular. Which I agree with here because the people talking about slogans wouldn’t agree to defund the police if you changed the slogan, that’s just how they’re choosing to fight against it right now.

 

I'm not accusing you of anything. There are two separate but intertwined arguments here: (1) what should be done and (2) how you get support for it.

 

...but it didn't just suddenly become electorally popular only because of activists convincing people it should be. We know pyschologically that's not how it works. People aren't just suddenly convinced of something that they vehemently disagreed with before. But the small steps or "compromises" if you will help break down some of those barriers and normalize it in people's minds. In addition of course to new generations being more accepting of their friends and relatives who are gay and realize that they're fighting against the rights of the people they love. Feels like there's been a few polls/studies on that with the #1 thing changing people's minds about gay rights was a family member coming out as gay. Can't be sure but I feel pretty confident we've seen that headline posted in this thread. The activists definitely helped people feel more comfortable about coming out, for sure. But there's a reason why a lot of states did civil unions first and didn't just jump straight to gay marriage.

 

Again I think this is very much not true. I've personally encountered a lot of people who were repulsed by the language of "defund the police" but would readily agree that we could shift funding away from police to other social services to help out on calls and etc.

There are some people that would like to abolish the police all together but that's not going mainstream for a long time.

 

Also, we're not keeping at the forefront of our minds that (1) they did it at the state level and (2) it was reflected in popular culture. It sounds very stupid (and is), but a hit TV show about activists with renegade cops as the antagonists would help move the needle a lot more than "DEFUND THE POLICE".

 

I can think of a ton of slogans that more people would support:

END POLICE BRUTALITY
FUND SOCIAL SERVICES NOW
HOLD COPS ACCOUNTABLE
NO MORE BAD COPS

 

Maybe we’re missing each other’s points because I agree. The slogan works if you’re able to explain it to people. The people we were talking about are those like Obama, Biden, and other centrists that criticize the messaging but also actually disagree with the substance and want to attack the issues in a way that supports the police state. I’m certainly open to alternative messaging as long it’s still the same and largely similar stance, which is to get rid of policing as we know it and replace it with a humane and racially and economically equal system.

 

For "hold cops accountable" I think we could go a little further and say "ARREST THE POLICE" or "JAIL THE POLICE" or etc. lol. It's a little bit more jarring but rolls off the tongue a little better and gets to the heart a major problem with the justice system and how it handles police brutality.

 

Yeah from what I saw of Obama's comments he seemed to side swipe the slogan and mentioned something about social services but seemed to completely avoid the part where you're shifting funding away from the police to fund some of those programs. A...uh, cop out, from him, which is sadly been too much from him since he left the presidency. Dude never has to get another job ever again and he sounds less activist now than he did before he was in elected office.

 

empty platitudes

 

Man, I am so stoked Lord & Taylor went out of business. Bought a Member's Only jacket for $25 today. Love these bougie stores collapsing.

 

I talked an old friend of mine that has his own State Farm office. He said they get PPP funding, which really confused me, considering it’s insurance and not like retail or some local business. I wanted to call him out on it, like “WTF do you need that for?” But I just let it go because we hadn’t talked in years.

 

I remember growing up whenever I went to the mall with my family we would always refer to Lord & Taylor as the store for rich people lol

 

SAME. My girlfriend convinced me to go and I was worried about prices. Some of the stuff was outrageous. She was trying to convince me to buy Polo... polos, which were still like $50 after 60% discounts. I found a bunch of flannels that came out to $7 instead lol. Ended up with a Members Only classic jacket, a MO winter coat, and four flannels for $70. She bought a single dress for $60. Pretty good bargins. Might go back since there are only two days left.