Jimmy Eat World - Surviving (October 18, 2019) Album • Page 59

This isn't a positive discussion because it involves some truly horrendous allegations that are 100% credible and should be treated as such. And no I will not stop talking about it. This is my favorite band in the entire world and I'm currently fighting back tears at work at the thought of them actually having done this. I can't continue to support any artists who give someone like Hardwick the time of day. So keep your toxic and harmful beliefs about survivors of abuse to yourself goddammit.

 

Why are you saying "blindly"? Why does believing a woman who has come forward to say "I have been abused" involve blindness? There's a lot of implicit shit in there about how you view women and women's credibility, and you should be seriously thinking about why you are this willing to defend your skepticism.

 

and i will continue to do so if you keep posting shit that warrants it.

 

I thought Hardwick's name was cleared. Maybe I was misinformed. Maybe people can simply be misinformed about things without being disgusting.

 

if you're not sure about what youre posting you shouldnt post it, its OK to be wrong, but youre going out of your way to defend something that you "heard online" that you yourself are admitting you might be wrong about.

 

How does this post in any way qualify as "simply being misinformed"? This is some red pill MRA trash right here.

 

Yeah, I'm way less willing to give the benefit of the doubt to someone claiming they were misinformed when they double down on their stance again and again and again

 

OK. Maybe that was a mistake posting what I heard online. I don't think it warranted the personal attacks though. I appreciate your comment. It's nicer than some of the others.

 

I havent doubled down. I said I might have been misinformed and please feel free to ignore me. I said I'm not that invested in the case and barely know who Chris Hardwick is. I'm not really doubling down here. Just defending myself from name-calling and personal insults. That's all I'm doubling down on.

 

Guys, I just said what I thought, and I acknowledged that I might have been wrong. I don't have evidence. I'm not that invested in this particular case. I'm not a men's rights activist. I have nothing to do with any of that stuff. Please can you all leave me some space? This is a little upsetting for me too.

 

Not really, though. Like, what is this? This is so inflammatory and comes off as intentionally provocative in a way that really doesn't seem like the product of being misinformed. If you genuinely were misinformed in the beginning, fine, but the appropriate thing to do would have been acknowledge that, apologize, and not play this whataboutism game.

 

You have the ability to log off. If you genuinely want to learn and do better, there's space for that here. But you can't pull this shit where you act like a victim for openly questioning the credibility of a survivor of abuse. That isn't going to work on this forum.

 

My comments about men vs. women was in response to you saying it's wrong to doubt a woman, but it's OK to assert that a man is guilty. I'm not sure I agree with that, and I'm not sure it's exactly black-and-white. It's OK to not agree on this stuff. But it doesn't mean I hate women (which is what I assume you think of me). My favourite people in the world are women.

 

Of all of the fanbases that I would've expected to immediately recognize when something is bad and act accordingly, I thought it would be this one. At least it looks like I was mostly right.

 

I want to talk about Jimmy Eat World though. I think some of you can learn and do better too. Maybe we all can learn and do better. Nobody should be attacked for not having everything figured out.

 

you really need to take a few steps back and log off for a while.

We are talking about Jimmy Eat World

 

But why me and not the people calling me disgusting? We have a disagreement but I haven't attacked or insulted anyone.

 

This is what I mean! No one said you hate women! No one. I don't assume anything about you except what you tell me. I'm not making judgement calls about your relationships with women. I'm saying you are showing us some less than ideal beliefs about how you view survivors of abuse, the majority of whom are women. If a man, had come forward, I'd be making the same arguments. Believe survivors of abuse. It's that simple.

 

Lets talk about the new Jimmy Eat World record......

 

I do believe survivors of abuse. I never said I didn't. But I had heard that his name was cleared. I wasn't 100% sure of it (hence I said "I think"). In the absence of other information, I believe survivors of abuse, because of course that's the right thing to do. I had heard that this was one of the very rare cases when an abuse story wasn't entirely factual, but again I might have been misinformed.

I think you got the wrong end of the stick in thinking that I blindly doubt survivors of abuse. Sorry that I wasn't clear on that.

 

This isn't a question of whether or not someone liked a movie or the most recent episode of a television show. There are no "disagreements" here. You either believe survivors of abuse or you're wrong. If people are getting heated about it, it's because it's a sensitive topic that a lot of people feel very strongly about. Many of whom on this site are survivors themselves.

So take a step back, log off for a while, and do some real thinking about what you've said and why it isn't as harmless as you think it is.

 

Clearing this up. I DID NOT say you shouldn't believe survivors. I DO believe survivors. But when I hear information that claims that somebody is lying, I will consider that too. But survivors are honest until proven otherwise. I THOUGHT that she was proven otherwise. But perhaps I was misinformed.

Does that clear it up?

 

I tried listening to the Hardwick/JEW episode (got 15 minutes in) but Chris is way too irritating. If anyone has interesting tidbits or the cliffs notes, post them in here, please.

 

If anyone thinks I was trying to spread the message that you shouldn't believe survivors, then I'm sorry I wasn't clear enough about my position.

 

counter-request: please do not post anything related to Chris Hardwick's podcast in this thread, please. Thanks.