Sexism/Feminism/Womanism Discussion Thread Social • Page 16

Well, the first step is realizing that it isn't about him.The process of accountability isn't meant to make him feel better or even for him to earn forgiveness. He assaulted someone and that injury extends beyond his victim to every woman who has to fear going to shows or dealing with musicians. The point of the process of accountability, then, is to ensure that this cannot happen again, to provide a framework of recourse, so those who have been/might be effected can have an actual voice to determine how their community functions and what they should do going forward. In other words, the process is less about making him whole or getting to a point where he can come back, and more about women working to make themselves feel safer. Even if he is remorseful, that may include making sure that, at every show, people know his history, preventing him from performing and so on, because being held accountable also means the recognition that your awareness doesn't necessarily mean a reprieve.

 

This is the crux of it.

 

Perfectly put as always, Dom.

 

Front Porch Step also deleted all the posts (as far as I can tell) with him "apologizing" or talking about the assaults from his Facebook.

The World Is A Beautiful Place... are posting about it on their Facebook

 

He blames it on bipolar/anxiety? Did I read one of those posts correctly?

 

My lil sis said she doesn't believe Johnny would be abusive and its so disappointing. I'm probably the last to talk but it's so weird when ppl act like they know celebs. You have no idea what he'd do. And it's like, do ppl think abusive ppl are all monsters all the time? they're manipulative and charming and sometimes even do nice things. It's just frustrating when ppl think those kind of ppl are obvious-looking scary monsters and couldn't possibly be the lovable guy across the street or whatever. Ppl act like you can just look at someone and know.

 

related
http://nymag.com/thecut/2016/06/bro...tter-of-support.html?mid=twitter-share-thecut

and yeah it's interesting how quick some people are to say "oh he didn't abuse one woman so he totally couldn't abuse any woman ever"

 

Yeah how does that quote go? Something about how not every serial killer kills everyone they meet just like abusers don't abuse everyone they meet either

 

It's crazy how quickly everyone turned on Amber.

 

She also said Depp is an addict and becomes abusive when he's using, which I can easily believe.

 

so many people post "gold digging bitches like these make it worst for actual domestic abuse victims" and im like are you fucking kidding me these ARE the actual domestic abuse victims

 

Depp always seems high out of his mind if you ask me.

 

Fuck Depp/the media

 

I think Alice through the looking glass tanked. I wonder if it was just terrible or the abuse had anything to do with it?

 

Probably multiple factors. It's a sequel six years after the original, the reviews were mostly bad, and the negative press around Depp probably contributed.

 

pretty much all of this

 

TW: assault

A fan attending Deafheaven's headline show in Melbourne was assaulted during High Tension's set. The person who committed was kicked out of the show. Karina put out a statement about the incident and the band are inviting people to talk about their experiences/ideas in hopes of finding ways to make shows safer.


Edit: not sure how to spoiler that link

 

A Hospital Took Thousands of Photos of Gynecological Surgery — And the Women Had No Idea

 

This. There's a reason people like him have to register for life as sex offenders if convicted. No matter how remorseful they are/may seem, the rate of recidivism is so high that those around them deserve to be put on notice, especially members of their target group (in this case teenage girls). Since it's seeming increasingly likely that this guy will never stand trial, reminding people of his history on social media and wherever he may try to perform is the best we can do.

 

I'm actually curious, what is the usual rate of recidivism. Not doubting it's high, just wondering.

 

The problems with recidivism are manifold. The first issue is, we see these people as monsters. They are not. They are men who take our cultural messages to their logical conclusions, eg, women are property, they are sex objects, we are entitled to their body and so on. So, precisely because we focus on them as individuals, rather than as individuals produced by a sick society, we can never actually address the problem on the individual and social level. That isn't to rob them of their agency in a horrible act, but it is to say that, so long as patriarchy remains a part of our cultural infrastructure, the violence women experience will continue. It will continue because under patriarchy suppression and violence are always-already the primary mediators in social relationships between men and women. Accountability is part of fighting this more broadly, but it is also part of a long-term project to undermine those social conventions.

 

Cultural/societal norms are of course a big part of why this behavior occurs but they aren't the only part, at least not in every case. Also I think placing the blame entirely on cultural/societal factors does rob the perpetrators of assault of their agency/responsibility and of the fact that, in the end, they still made a choice. I'm sorry but I don't agree with you on this at all. I think blaming everything on society is wrong, these people still had a choice in the moment.

The answer is to focus on advocating for societal change while also ensuring those who have already committed this offense are dealt with appropriately. Because there is a need to keep those around past sex offenders informed of their presence/history, especially when those people are members of the offender's target group. In the case of this guy, everything he is doing is focused around being able to regain access to his target group (young teenage fans who listen to his music). I'm not necessarily saying he's a monster (though, as someone outside of his target group and in a position of privilege, I wouldn't begrudge anyone who does call him that), but as someone who has exhibited a clear pattern of abusive behavior towards members of this group in the past, he is dangerous. No amount of using societal factors as an excuse changes that and he needs to be given the proper treatment.

 

I think we are speaking past one another. One can understand the role cultural paradigms play in creating individuals and acknowledge the culpability of those those individuals that perpetrate gendered violence. The former does not preclude accountability, and it allows us to see individual acts in a broader context, which enhances our ability to not only hold individuals, but systems of power relations accountable.

 

I agree with that. I misunderstood what you were trying to say in your reply, I think.

 

And on a related note, Jasmine Richards, a black lives matter activist, is facing up to four years in court for "felony lynching". I doubt the judge will offer the same sort of mercy to this black woman that was offered to the perpetrator of the Stanford rape.

DN!