General Politics Discussion [ARCHIVED] • Page 71

But there isn't a "vote against Trump side." If the democratic process included such a function, there would be no issue. The issue, instead, is that those who are fearful of Trump would have you vote for Clinton. Also, there would be more momentum behind the only-hope-Hillary narrative if it hadn't began a year ago and been used, despite being against a fair amount of predictive evidence, to marginalize support for Sanders and, alternatively, Stein.

 

So in your opinion, what is the best course of action to try and stop Trump?

 

Yes, because Clinton is by and large the clear better choice in the general that also is the only choice with a chance to win the general election against Trump (The same would be true if Sanders were the Democratic candidate). Those fearful of Trump and want to stop him are, in fact, pushing the best possible way to do so--voting for whoever wins the Democratic Primary.

I seriously doubt the fact that some people pushed her as the only way to win early on is really stopping anyone from supporting her now. And Hillary or anyone else for that matter didn't have to do anything to marginalize support for Stein, reality already did that for her.

 

POLITICO Magazine has a story this morning called "How Hillary Loses" and outlines the mistakes she could make that would cost her the election.

Link: How Hillary loses: Four mistakes that could cost her the election

Personally I think this is reaching a bit. I understand that national polling has them neck in neck right now, but its only May and the demographics in swing states favor her quite a bit. I would be very surprised if Trump could flip Wisconsin or Pennsylvania red and that seems to be his only path to victory.

I think this is the media pushing a "close race" narrative because people don't tune in when they know it is going to be a blowout. Also the author of this article is a Bernie guy I believe, and is probably trying to make the case that Bernie would be a stronger general election candidate than Hillary. I disagree with that argument, but understand where they are coming from. Would like to hear others' thoughts on it though.

 

Step 2: Alienate the young

Her biggest hurdle, IMO

 

I agree, she does terribly with the young. But its also a demographic that doesn't reliably turn out and vote.. I mean just look at what happened to Sanders. Also I think that Trump being her opponent helps her in that regard. He polls terribly with young people. Also once Obama starts campaigning for her and if Bernie endorses her and campaigns for her, I think we will see her favorability start to tick upwards a bit. But not much.

 

Idk with tweets like this I think she will struggle with the Hispanic vote.

 

Hispanics: "Well I really don't want my friends and family deported.... but god damn if I don't love me some taco bowls...TRUMP 2016!!!"

 

I meant since he does love Hispanics, they will all vote him over Hillary.

 

I know I read your reply wrong and fixed my joke. My bad

 

I don't know how I feel about a Taco Bowl made at Trump Tower "Grill". Especially with ground beef.

 

Bernie Sanders just did an interview with Univision and when asked about problems in Latin America he deferred saying "You are asking me questions about Latin America that I am very interested in but right now I’m running for president of the United States."

Link: Bernie Sanders says he should know more about Latin America | Fusion

I am not sure how I feel about this. I currently support Hillary but I have given money to Sanders because I like his emphasis on campaign finance reform and income inequality. However stuff like this is the reason I can't fully support him for president. He seems to have little interest in foreign affairs and, thus, does not have much knowledge on it either. I think that is fine for a Senator, but not a good trait of a President. Also I think Hillary Clinton, whether you agree with her or not, is far more knowledgeable on foreign policy. Am I missing something? What do you guys think?

 

It's probably hard to be like, well I'm not socialist and this isn't the same thing, when you call yourself a socialist. And ya, he hasn't had to make any real decisions on foreign policy besides voting. And I think it's easy to always vote for the one that seems the most "moral".

 

His interviews generally do not end well. Yeah, he was being honest with, "I don't know", but even if he just gave a BS answer like, "I don't know the answer, but we would all sit down and discuss etc..." that'd be better. People rail Trump for being unpresidential in a boisterous sense, but Bernie is unpresidential in the opposite way that he won't deviate from his Stump speech.

Here's another interview I was going to post (yes its posted on buzzfeed but plz read it): Bernie Sanders Gets In Snippy Exchange With California Radio Hosts

It's the "if you don't agree with me completely, you're corrupt" attitude that's his downfall and very problematic.

 

Another problematic interview response, showing his lack of deviation from his "stump speech":

Bernie Sanders to Oregonians: Drop Off Your Ballots or I’m Toast

 

Also, I noticed a lot during the debates, they would ask him something and he would say "look we need to talk about the most important issue which is wealth inequality". He has his answers, and doesn't know anything outside of it.

 

Exactly. Yes, you could argue that these issues are the more important ones, but when his usual answer on foreign policy revolves around, "I voted against Iraq" that just doesn't work. We get it, you're isolationist. When you're president, more issues are going to come up that your experience "voting against Iraq" won't help.

 

Also I still stand by my post earlier that it's probably productive to break off election talk into a different thread

 

We could do that. Who sets it up though? and what would this thread even really talk about then?

 

Why?

 

Exactly. This has been my issue with him too. He relates EVERYTHING to income inequality. I understand that it is an underlying issue that has broad implications for many Americans but I think there are other problems that he is not addressing. I think this is a big reason why he has struggled to get black voters. He frames their struggles in an economic sense and places less emphasis on institutional racism than Hillary does.

And yes, I get the sense from his supporters that anyone who doesn't agree with everything he says is either stupid or misinformed or literally a Republican. It doesn't make for the best debate when you are already labeled as a moron just for disagreeing.

 

I mean, anyone can post it, I was more so leaving it up to the mods based on how they wanna keep things organized.

 

If I weren't American I'd feel pretty out of place in this thread.

 

Gotcha. Ya I mean we could do that. I feel like it's always gonna be finding its way back to this thread.

 

I get that. I also have not seen anyone really post about world news much. Idk I think it would leave this thread without much to talk about. Maybe make a world politics thread?